Court claim

KeithP

You have told us next to nothing about the parking incident.

Does the quality of the signs play any part?

Did the driver have permission to park there?

Was parking actually forbidden where the car was parked?


Have you read post #2 of the NEWBIES thread?

Have you looked at any of the Defences linked from there?

alcaw76

I honestly don't know whether the signage is or was adequate. The incident was almost two years ago now and at the time when the NtK first came through I researched everything and believed we had grounds to win based on the NtK being served late. I am now starting to think I should not be relying on this quite so heavily.

The car did not have permission to be there and, according to signs, it was forbidden to park there. I have read post #2 and some of the Defences linked there but am struggling to apply any to our situation, hence why I have said that I think my only defence points are the NtK arriving late and the parking company ignoring my offer to go to independent adjudication.

alcaw76

I can obviously go back to the car park and take photos of signage etc but I would have no idea if the situation has changed in the interim.

KeithP

alcaw76 wrote: »

The car did not have permission to be there and, according to signs, it was forbidden to park there.

If the signs forbid parking, then there cannot have been a contract agreed with the driver.
It therefore follows that no term of the alleged contract could be broken, hence no charge can be levied.

You need pictures of the signs as evidence.

alcaw76 wrote: »

I can obviously go back to the car park and take photos of signage etc but I would have no idea if the situation has changed in the interim.

Look on Google Street View. You may be able to see what the signs looked like in 2017.

Redx

plenty of defence points in the examples by people like BARGEPOLE, especially his concise defence

typical defence points for ADR and court cases include

POFA2012 issues
NOT THE DRIVER
NO LANDOWNER CONTRACT
NO PARKING CONTRACT ENTERED INTO
POOR AND INADEQUATE SIGNAGE
FORBIDDING SIGNAGE
ANY BPA or IPC CoP failures
CRA2015 failures

etc

alcaw76

Google Street View is for August 2018 so out of luck there. All I can do it get photos of how they are now.

Not sure I follow your part above about the signs forbidding parking. I will have to try and confirm exactly what the signs say, but their NtK says that terms and conditions of parking there were displayed on signage and that by parking there you are bound to these terms and conditions and liable to pay a charge if you breach them. Not sure if signs expressly forbid parking there altogether though...

KeithP

alcaw76 wrote: »

Google Street View is for August 2018 so out of luck there.

Really?

Can you not step back in time in GSV?

Which car park?

Redx

so you put them to strict proof that their signs were compliant and that a parking contract was on offer at the time

their lack of evidence could be their undoing, so you make them prove their case to a judge by making them prove their landowner contract, signage etc

there can be no contract to park if the signs forbade parking (by say permit holders only)

if there was a contract to park on offer, did the driver meet those conditions of being allowed to park, and in any case if POFA was not followed then a keeper isnt liable even if a driver breached the terms on the signs


some car parks offer free parking


some offer it providing a ticket is obtained


some offer it if a ticket is paid for


some forbid parking except for authorised users like permit holders

alcaw76

KeithP wrote: »

Really?

Can you not step back in time in GSV?

Which car park?

Well you live and learn! You can indeed go back in time, but unfortunately no signs are visible.

Not sure if links work on here but here is the car park:

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.1464968,0.8765903,3a,75y,205.08h,97.97t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sXuM7Ba-qJEx9zzUsdNqGEg!2e0!5s20170601T000000!7i13312!8i6656

alcaw76

Redx wrote: »

so you put them to strict proof that their signs were compliant and that a parking contract was on offer at the time

their lack of evidence could be their undoing, so you make them prove their case to a judge by making them prove their landowner contract, signage etc

there can be no contract to park if the signs forbade parking (by say permit holders only)

if there was a contract to park on offer, did the driver meet those conditions of being allowed to park, and in any case if POFA was not followed then a keeper isnt liable even if a driver breached the terms on the signs


some car parks offer free parking


some offer it providing a ticket is obtained


some offer it if a ticket is paid for


some forbid parking except for authorised users like permit holders

The car park is for the customers of a town and country store so I can only presume that the it operates on the basis that once you make a purchase within the store, your number plate is marked as authorised. I will have to go back and see what the signs say though.