Legal threat - unjust?

davidmcn

Dean000000 wrote: »

No money needs to change hand to form a contract.

I don't think that's what they're arguing.

I think it's reasonable to infer from "Should you wish to go ahead we would require a 50% deposit" that in this case they mean "we won't consider a contract to have formed (or start incurring potentially irrecoverable costs) unless and until we get the 50% deposit from you".

[Deleted User]

davidmcn wrote: »

I don't think that's what they're arguing.

I think it's reasonable to infer from "Should you wish to go ahead we would require a 50% deposit" that in this case they mean "we won't consider a contract to have formed (or start incurring potentially irrecoverable costs) unless and until we get the 50% deposit from you".

But the supplier also claims that his wife gave them permission to continue when they sized up the windows, which would have been after the fact. Deliberately ignoring all of their communication efforts after that has vastly complicated things for the OP.

Dean000000

davidmcn wrote: »

I don't think that's what they're arguing.

I think it's reasonable to infer from "Should you wish to go ahead we would require a 50% deposit" that in this case they mean "we won't consider a contract to have formed (or start incurring potentially irrecoverable costs) unless and until we get the 50% deposit from you".

Except that’s not what happened. There was further contact after this email - where op states he asked ‘when can you come and install it’ which is where I infer that a contract may have been formed.

As well as their assertion the other half sanctioned it...

Jumblebumble

Dean000000 wrote: »

Except that’s not what happened. There was further contact after this email - where op states he asked ‘when can you come and install it’ which is where I infer that a contract may have been formed.

As well as their assertion the other half sanctioned it...

I fear that this is being made too complicated
As I understand it the only thing in writing is the fact that there is no commitment till 50% deposit is paid.
The Glazier presumably has no evidence that a third party sanctioned The OP's contract and since when can the wife enter into a contract on his behalf ?
The OP enquiring about the potential lead time if he paid the 50% deposit is neither here nor there
I would never pay a company who behaved like this as they are clearly trying it on and do not believe that I would be liable to either morraly or legally
The Glazier is a dishonest fool

JumbleBumble

unholyangel

Dean000000 wrote: »

That’s someone that doesn’t understand the make up of a contract.

No money needs to change hand to form a contract.

I believe thats a good example of pot calling kettle. No money usually needs to be exchanged in order to make a contract (unless its a condition as they seem to have expressly indicated here) but there does need to be an offer, acceptance of that offer on exactly the terms the offer is made (any variation amounts to a counter offer, not acceptance), that acceptance needs to be communicated to the offeror, there needs to be certainty, consideration (which must be something of value and can't be something past), intent to be legally bound etc.

There is no requirement to reject any offer.

If they had already been given the go ahead, why would they then say "if you wish to go ahead" in their email?

More to the point, before a contract is binding on a consumer, the retailer needs to provide certain information - that information includes the total price of the goods or services. If it was made in the consumers home then they need to expressly (in writing) state that they want the contract to begin early and acknowledge they'll lose the right to cancel.

As to the OP.....anyone can send debt collectors after you - whether you owe them money or not. But in order to send proper bailiffs or have a ccj registered on your credit history, they would need to take you to court and you would need to lose and then not pay within the time allowed by the court (usually a month).

Dean000000

unholyangel wrote: »

I believe thats a good example of pot calling kettle. No money usually needs to be exchanged in order to make a contract (unless its a condition as they seem to have expressly indicated here) but there does need to be an offer £185 , acceptance yes please....how soon can you install? of that offer on exactly the terms the offer is made (any variation amounts to a counter offer, not acceptance) my scenario proffers that acceptance has taken place. No variation to offer , that acceptance needs to be communicated how soon can you start? to the offeror, there needs to be certainty, consideration 24hrs ok? (which must be something of value and can't be something past), intent to be legally bound etc.

There is no requirement to reject any offer. agreed. But hugely impolite

If they had already been given the go ahead, why would they then say "if you wish to go ahead" in their email?
Malready said on several occasions where I think the contract was formed. Read back to see - when you do you’ll realise this is irrelevant.

More to the point, before a contract is binding on a consumer, the retailer needs to provide certain information - that information includes the total price of the goods or services.£185 If it was made in the consumers home then they need to expressly (in writing) state that they want the contract to begin early and acknowledge they'll lose the right to cancel.

As to the OP.....anyone can send debt collectors after you - whether you owe them money or not. But in order to send proper bailiffs or have a ccj registered on your credit history, they would need to take you to court and you would need to lose and then not pay within the time allowed by the court (usually a month).

Cba to make this all pretty and logical.

My point in any case was responding to the first response that no contract was formed ‘ignore’

Just saying This may not be the case.

unholyangel

Dean000000 wrote: »

Cba to make this all pretty and logical.

My point in any case was responding to the first response that no contract was formed ‘ignore’

Just saying This may not be the case.

By that point the business had included the condition of 50% deposit being required in their offer.

Its like the "subject to contract" clause. It doesn't matter what happens before that point if the condition isn't fulfilled, then no contract is formed as they have previously offered to only be bound on that basis and cannot therefore change the goalposts after the fact to bind the other party.

Dean000000

I disagree. But hey...there you go.

Good luck op.

MobileSaver

Derp111 wrote: »

- Email from the glazing company (day 4) saying:
Should you wish to go ahead we would require a 50% deposit"

As you have this in writing you are almost guaranteed to win should the glazier chance their arm by taking you to court.

How could the glazier possibly state a contract had been formed when you hadn't paid the 50% deposit they themselves state is required?

Derp111 wrote: »

I don't suppose you can point me where to go/look at for if a summons comes through the post?

I disagree that you should ignore the glazier. What you should do is simply write/email back denying the debt and explain that you have it in writing that you had to pay a 50% deposit before giving them the go ahead and that you did not pay any such deposit or give them the go ahead.

As they have already threatened legal action also advise them that you will robustly defend any such action and counter claim for your costs, fees and expenses. Keep it all very short, sweet and factual.

You should receive a formal Letter Before Action from the glazier before any summons arrives from the court so just post back here with whatever arrives next (if anything.)

[Deleted User]

MobileSaver wrote: »

As you have this in writing you are almost guaranteed to win should the glazier chance their arm by taking you to court.

How could the glazier possibly state a contract had been formed when you hadn't paid the 50% deposit they themselves state is required?

They would argue that the following quote would usurp that and that they waived the 50% deposit as they'd spoken personally to their other half, so I wouldn't say it's cut & dried by any measure. The OP deliberately ignoring their communications would also perhaps go against them as it could be spun that it was malicious and done purely to avoid paying for something they'd agreed to.

Dear Derp, we came over [day 3] to measure your double glazed sealed unit with the hole cut out for the cat flap, your partner Derp2 confirmed the purchase.
Since then we have not been able to contact either of you to arrange installation.