Advisor fees transfer of isa to spouse on death

Mistermeaner

I contacted Parmenion directly this morning telling them we don;t want to use the advisor to effect the transfer of mums ISA to dad. They replied:

"In respect of the APS process, as we offer an advised service only, I'm afraid CRS Consultants will have to request the APS process online as this is an advised process. They will be able to do this once we've received the death certificate in the post. When they have initiated the process through your father's account online, it will produce forms that your father will need to sign, the executors and adviser. This will also need to be sent in with the original Grant of Probate so we can complete the process our end."


I replied to state:
"Re the APS we do not want to be tied to using crs - can you please advise alternatives ; ie we will be willing to sell the holdings to cash and use our aps with an alternative provider"


To which they advised:

"To disinvest the funds we will still require the original Grant of Probate and a written instruction signed by all the executors confirming where you'd like the proceeds to be paid.

I'm not able to advise you, however the only way you can process the APS with us is through the registered adviser on the portfolio.

If you decide to apply for the APS through an alternative ISA provider we will require their APS valuation request."


So i guess the next steps are to get probate etc. and to set up an 'inheritance ISA' in dads name with nationwide (for simplicity)... then sell the holdings within the parmenion ISA and pay the cash into the nationwide inheritance ISA

Does this sound about correct?

Alexland

Sure if you want to avoid the advisor's one off fee (which we broadly agree is unreasonable given they are serviced customers) then you could help your dad do it himself however this will leave him with a big cash ISA earning below inflation and an advisor who is only partially servicing his wealth.

What's the plan next?

Alex

xylophone

He could liquidate Mum's ISA and transfer to a stocks and shares ISA with another provider who would accept APS?

He might consider liquidating both and transferring to another provider?

Mistermeaner

Alexland wrote: »

Sure if you want to avoid the advisor's one off fee (which we broadly agree is unreasonable given they are serviced customers) then you could help your dad do it himself however this will leave him with a big cash ISA earning below inflation and an advisor who is only partially servicing his wealth.

What's the plan next?

Alex

fair question; plan next would be to also sell dads isa and move the lot over to nationwide (within the isa wrapper). It will be earning a paltry 1.4% but will be free of the advisor

From there I will look to set up an S&S platform such as charles stanley or H&L and self invest a portion of the funds in something suitable (VLS20 or similar)

NB: I self manage my pension, my LISA's and S&S ISA's held variously accross HL, Charles Stanley and Zurich ... im no expert but am reasonably proficient in this stuff (mainly from stuff learned here!)

Alexland

Mistermeaner wrote: »

From there I will look to set up an S&S platform such as charles stanley or H&L and self invest a portion of the funds in something suitable (VLS20 or similar)

If you are going to help him go DIY then rather than invest in a very low risk fund it might be better to invest in a mix of cash and a balanced risk fund such as VLS60 to stand a good chance of keeping up with inflation. Considering the amount involved iWeb might have a more attractive fee structure.

Alex

dunstonh

From there I will look to set up an S&S platform such as charles stanley or H&L and self invest a portion of the funds in something suitable (VLS20 or similar)

HL is expensive and VLS20 is a low quality fund. VLS is better up the scale but not great lower down the scale.

How does VLS20 compare to the volatility rating of the existing investments? Are you taking him out of something earning around 5-7% a year after charges into something earning around 2-3% after lower charges?

Mistermeaner

dunstonh wrote: »

HL is expensive and VLS20 is a low quality fund. VLS is better up the scale but not great lower down the scale.

How does VLS20 compare to the volatility rating of the existing investments? Are you taking him out of something earning around 5-7% a year after charges into something earning around 2-3% after lower charges?

its invested in a mish mash of bond funds that have earned 10% over the last 3 years before fee's... so around 3% per annum

Honestly I haven't thought as far ahead as what underlying investments to buy into...

FYI dad is 82 and has plenty of income from pensions his primary objective is capital preservation

thanks all for input

Mistermeaner

Discussions with advisor continue ; I’ve told them unless they wave the 1.5% fee for transferring mums isa to dad I’ll do it myself

Regards the ongoing fee they’ve been charged 0.5% per annum since these plans were set up in 2015 - there’s no record of anything being done in respect of reviews in my mums files and I’ve asked the advisor to provide me details and records of what they’ve been doing for this fee... they ummed and arrred and said theyll get back to me .... I have a feeling they’ve done nothing other than take my mum and dads money each month (all portfolio balancing was done by parmenion) .... do I have any scope / opportunity to recover fees paid for ongoing management if there hasn’t been any?

Also if I just terminate this ongoing management from now could they mess me around regards transferring both mums and dads ISAs out of parmenion to a.n.other ?


Thanks

dunstonh

Ask for a copy of the fee agreement showing what services are provided for the 0.50%. The FCA do not state what services are required to be listed. However, they do say that advisers should be doing what they say they are doing. And post-January 2013 (on business set up after that date) they must be doing something in return for the remuneration. They can't just take 0.5% and sit back.

The exception is St James Place who can charge and do nothing.

I have a feeling they’ve done nothing other than take my mum and dads money each month (all portfolio balancing was done by parmenion) .... do I have any scope / opportunity to recover fees paid for ongoing management if there hasn’t been any?

The platform provides no advice or manual rebalancing or adjustments. The adviser firm does that (or the DFM, if one of them is involved). The platform does have an automatic rebalancing functionality but that just takes it back to the original allocation or the last set allocation input by the adviser. If the allocations have changed, then an adviser working under "advisory" rules must get permission first to make changes. If under DFM (discretionary) rules, then they do not.

As above, if the work they agreed to do has not been carried out, then you should be refunded.

Also if I just terminate this ongoing management from now could they mess me around regards transferring both mums and dads ISAs out of parmenion to a.n.other ?

no

Mistermeaner

hi thanks for help with this. Working through various details of mums estate and have come back to these guys again!

I have asked on numerous occasions for details of the original 'ongoing services agreement' - all they have sent me is a document my mum and dad signed back in 2015 which states the ongoing service fee of 0.5%/annum and refers to 'ongoing services as outlined in our standard client service agreement'

I don't have this document in the files i have, nor is it on their website. I have requested it but nothing has yet been provided.

So in a nutshell these guys have taken ~5K from my mum and dad over the last 4 years provided 'ongoing services' and cannot tell me what (a) these should have been nor (b) provide any evidence of what they have done for this fee

Do I have a reasonable case to ask for this money back?

How would one go about making such a complaint? I am dealing with them directly but they appear to be stonewalling so thinking of escalation somewhere