Ridiculous Sting. Another unscrupulous Parking Company.

The_Deep

The driver pulled into the car park to answer a phone call, the driver did not leave the car.

The driver was in the car park for less than 15 minutes and has been hit with a £ three figure fine notice! This is utterly disgraceful, in my opinion.

How could the driver even have bought a ticket or read the signs if they did not leave the car?

They have you bang to rights, breach of contract, trespass, ranting, misplaced indignation, ignorance of the law, pay the money.

DorianWolf

I completely disagree, but I'm getting rapidly disconcerted about the strength of a possible case.

The driver did not remain on their land with the intention of parking, and left relatively quickly. I don't feel that is misplaced indignation at all. Only 13 minutes elapsed between entry and exit, but is this within a recognised grace period, I just don't know? Research is showing that a grace period is normally now 11 minutes. But as I feel this is now the main focus, the only point to argue, I'm getting concerned that it is neither.

I've scoured through POFA 2012 schedule 4 and everything listed within appears to correlate with the NTK in some form, so I don't believe there's any way that could be used.

I know that it could be a long fight with many twists and turns, but at this stage I'm struggling to see where my focus for an argument could come from, which is leaving me nervous about potentially losing this one.

MistyZ

DorianWolf wrote: »

Research is showing that a grace period is normally now 11 minutes. But as I feel this is now the main focus, the only point to argue, I'm getting concerned that it is neither.

Google 'British Parking Association Code of Practice' and check out section 13. This makes it clear that there should be two separate grace periods and is oft-quoted in POPLA appeals. Whether the POPLA assessor will take a blind bit of notice is another matter, to put it politely, they are inconsistent.

15 minutes is a very short parking period. Nobody should be landed with a whopping great parking charge for that. The fact that it's unfair, a scam etc. can't be used at the POPLA stage but it's one of the many things that motivates people to fight back so tenaciously.

You throw everything you can at a POPLA appeal, ensuring that the most relevant points (such as grace periods and signage in this case) are as emphatic and detailed as possible. This gives a decent chance of winning. Whether or not a person chooses to go down this route depends a lot on just how indignant they are.

Did you send the first appeal blue template?

beamerguy

MistyZ wrote: »

Google 'British Parking Association Code of Practice' and check out section 13. This makes it clear that there should be two separate grace periods and is oft-quoted in POPLA appeals. Whether the POPLA assessor will take a blind bit of notice is another matter, to put it politely, they are inconsistent.

Also Kelvin Reynolds, Head of Public Affairs and Policy at the British Parking Association says .......

“No time limit is specified"

https://www.britishparking.co.uk/News/good-car-parking-practice-includes-grace-periods

"to put it politely, they are inconsistent" <<< POPLA

Best word is INCOMPETENT

DorianWolf

MistyZ. Could you please give some examples of deficient signage, I have taken photographs of theirs, and apart from one small spelling error, they appear to me to be correct, although there is obviously no mention of grace periods. I am planning further visits to take more photographs of the area.

The blue template has not as yet been sent. I wanted to gauge feeling on the forum first as to how strong a case of this description could be, before sending.

And yes RobinifLoxley, there is both an entry and exit time stamp image on the NTK for the 13 minutes in question.

And thanks Beamerguy, all information that can be used to research and build a case is extremely useful.

DorianWolf

beamerguy wrote: »

Also Kelvin Reynolds, Head of Public Affairs and Policy at the British Parking Association says .......

“No time limit is specified"

https://www.britishparking.co.uk/News/good-car-parking-practice-includes-grace-periods

"to put it politely, they are inconsistent" <<< POPLA

Is the POPLA assessors decision final, or can that be challenged?

I won't have been this far in a case so would like to get a picture of all possible scenarios before the journey begins.

Ralph-y

"Is the POPLA assessors decision final, or can that be challenged?"




yes except in rare procedural errors



and


no you can not




"would like to get a picture of all possible scenarios before the journey begins."


this is a massive area .. you will be best served by reading the newbies thread





https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822/newbies-private-parking-ticket-old-or-new-read-these-faqs-first-thankyou


Ralph:cool:

MistyZ

DorianWolf wrote: »

MistyZ. Could you please give some examples of deficient signage, I have taken photographs of theirs, and apart from one small spelling error, they appear to me to be correct, although there is obviously no mention of grace periods. I am planning further visits to take more photographs of the area.

If you look at examples or POPLA appeals (via links in the Newbies' thread and a search of the forum) you will find very comprehensive criticism of signage. Prior to the 'parking event' and parking charge that brought me here, I thought a sign was a sign and if I didn't get the message loud & clear then that was all my fault. Then I read the POPLA signage sections here and assessed photos of signage in the car park in the light of that information. It soon dawned on me that the signs were not intended to give motorists clear information, they were not user-friendly, they did not comply with best practice. They were at the top of high poles or high up on walls, situated so that reading them was difficult or even downright dangerous, some of the font was smaller than it should be, there were omissions etc. etc.

The successful POPLA appeals or templates are a great resource here. It is perfectly okay to copy whole sections, tweaking them carefully so that they relate to the particular circumstances.

Also, the fact is that this might (might) go all the way to court. Something that really impresses me about this forum is that members very often get ongoing and first rate support from the experienced members for years in that instance!! So many win, ultimately. The vast majority? I think so.

Umkomaas

Super post MistyZ, your posts are real positive contributions to the forum. Hope you can stay with us.

DorianWolf

How might this go all the way to court then Ralph-y, if the POPLA decision is, in almost all straightforward cases, final?