Compelled to go to other platform to buy ticket

jimbo6977

Any legal beagles or Conditions of carriage specialists out there?

Rail conditions of carriage compel the passenger to have a ticket even if the only ticket booth/machine is on a platform othrr than the one from which the passenger's service is departing.

If the walk from the departure platform to the ticket office/machine involves leaving railway premises, on what basis can the ticket requirement be enforced? Surely railway law/rules cannot compel a form of behaviour outwith railway premises?

Many thanks!

lammy82

That's a good one

Couldn't you just visit the other platform first? If the rules require you to have a ticket, there is no law that says that the ticket must be purchased from the part of the premises that you happen to have wandered into first.

Voyager2002

The passenger would be expected to buy a ticket before going to the departure platform. What is the issue?

lammy82

Actually, I think the answer you're looking for is that no, you cannot be compelled, it's completely up to you. If you don't want to, you can choose not to, and not travel by train. If you are insistent upon boarding the train then you are effectively compelling yourself to obtain the ticket.

tacpot12

The only ticket booth isn't only on another platform; it's in my living room or wherever I can get a WiFi signal! I can buy a ticket anywhere, and I am compelled to do so if I want to travel on a train.

jimbo6977

ctually, I think the answer you're looking for is that no, you cannot be!compelled, it's completely up to you. If you don't want to, you can choose not to, and not travel by train. If you are insistent upon boarding the train then you are effectively compelling yourself to obtain the ticket.

ok but the point im driving at is

1. a passenger is obliged to have a ticket if they had the "opportunity" to purchase one prior to travel

2. the rules regard the provision of a ticket office or machine on a platform other than the one from which the passenger is travelling as constituting an "opportunity".

but i contend that

1. if there is no route entirely within railway premises between the departing platform and the ticket sales point, the railway rules are attempting to oblige the passenger to behave in a particular way on land that is outside their jurisdiction, which they cannot.

1. given this, the circumstances described (ticket sales point on other platform, no path on railway land between the two platforms) cannot constitute an "opportunity" to purchase a ticket, and the passenger cannot be penalised for boarding a train without one.

similarly, it is already the case that, because a railway company cannot oblige anyone to own a smartphone or computer and an internet connection, online sales do not constitute an "opportunity".

Owain_Moneysaver

jimbo6977 wrote: »

1. if there is no route entirely within railway premises between the departing platform and the ticket sales point, the railway rules are attempting to oblige the passenger to behave in a particular way on land that is outside their jurisdiction, which they cannot.

The railway rules don't apply outside railway land, but they do apply when you enter, or re-enter, railway land.

The only way your contention would hold water would be if the route from Platform 1 and Platform 2 were so lengthy or difficult it would be unreasonable to consider that tickets were available at that station. Route entirely within railway premises isn't relevant otherwise.

Anyway, you can purchase tickets at another station, or on the train. If the issue is on-train sellers not selling off-peak tickets, you can buy your ticket on the train the day before.

stragglebod

What an absolute load of drivel.

Neil49

stragglebod wrote: »

What an absolute load of drivel.

Totally agree.

Hopefully the next time he goes for a train they go and change the departure platform.

Kite2010

I can think of many stations where there is only 1 TVM for 2 platforms and anybody wanting to buy a ticket for a train from the platform without the machine has to cross over to purchase a ticket.

esuhl

The definitely should make it OBVIOUS that you can buy a ticket from the other platform.

I once got a penalty fare coming back from a party. I was very hungover/drunk, it was before 6am, and leaving from a small two-platform station.

I walked through a ticket office with all the shutters down and past a ticket machine that was out of order. I walked up and down the platform, peered over at the other side, and saw no sign of any way to buy a ticket.

A team of ticket inspectors was on the train, so got on and asked for a ticket. The doors closed and I was told that there was another booking hall on the other platform through an unsigned archway, right at the far end.

I apologised and explained that I had no idea: there were no signs, and I clearly wasn't trying to avoid buying a ticket as I'd approached them. And given that it was nearly a 3hr journey on five trains, there's no way I'd hope to avoid a ticket check. But they still fined me £20. Grrr!

I was equally furious and baffled, since the fare would have been over £15 anyway. So I effectively paid less than £5 to have an argument with five people for five minutes. Seems like the train companies lost out financially by fining me... :-/

----

But come on, if you know there's a ticket machine, why would it matter (either practically or legally) whether you have to go outside the station to access it?

What justifiable reason could you have for not buying a ticket when you know the facility is there?