Vendor's EA, ID and Money Laundering rules

G_M

Does this help?


https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/money-laundering-regulations-2007-supervision-of-estate-agency-businesses

System

Hi jonnygee,

Thanks for further helping to tease out this interesting theoretical legal hypothetical and also real situation. I see you're also a member of the pc master race (Pc vs Consul thread) Welcome brother!! So obviously using your superior intellect you've obviously seen both sides of the equation here so I will agree with you and say that between us we both have added value to the complete picture

What's important and relevant is that I'd say 97.5% of those asked to provide ID wouldn't query it and then probably only .5% 1 in 500 wouldn't provide ID when asked and of those me and Red are part of that 1/500 population.

As I mentioned though all of that document that GM has just provided the link to "all refer to the estate agent" and not the buyer. So there are no penalties for a law abiding buyer and there's nothing the estate agent can do.

We could ask GM for clarification GM who is generally considered the General Operations Director here on Moneysavingexpert.com people just call him GOD for short and not without good reason.

According to the law is it correct that buyers cannot be punished or forced to give ID to an estate agent?

I personally think the answer to the above question is yes.

davidmcn

paranoidandroid31978 wrote: »

According to the law is it correct that buyers cannot be punished or forced to give ID to an estate agent?

Not "punished" or "forced", but they don't need to do business with you.

And anybody working under these regulations is entitled to view a reluctance to provide ID as itself being grounds for suspicion.

ACG

I very rarely side with an estate agent, I do not trust most of them as far as I could throw them.

However, there is a requirement to verify you are legit, but there are no hard and fast rules as to how that must be done.

As an example, a letter from a solicitor would theoretically do the job - would I take that as a broker? No. Would a Mortgage lender accept that? No. So the agents are not necessarily in the wrong, but I can see your point. You could go direct to the vendor/your solicitor deal with the agents solicitor but as a vendor, would you want to deal with someone who does not want to provide ID to a company I have employed to sell my home for tens or hundreds of thousands?

We would want address ID and photo ID. We may even want 2 forms of one or both and/or do an electronic ID check on you. I also do other ID checks if I have any concerns but that does not require the customer to do anything.

Surrey_EA

If ever there was a poster who had an appropriate username!

davidmcn

paranoidandroid31978 wrote: »

They may think it's suspicious but contained in the context of the conversation most reasonable people would think it's reasonable.

But you've also said it's how only 0.2% of the population would behave - so if you choose to put yourself in the same 0.2% as those who have nefarious reasons for hiding their true identity, expect to be treated the same as them.

G_M

paranoidandroid31978 wrote: »

.......
We could ask GM for clarification GM who is generally considered the General Operations Director here on Moneysavingexpert.com people just call him GOD for short and not without good reason.
.

:rotfl:
With regards to this matter I have no more knowledge than the next god. The link I provided took me 20 seconds to find on google - and I didn't even read it!

According to the law is it correct that buyers cannot be punished or forced to give ID to an estate agent?

Buyers cannot be sent to prison for this. Nor fined. And my understanding is that (sadly) the stocks are no longer in use. So - no, buyers cannot be punished according to the law

Nor can they be forced to give ID. No amount of arm-twisting or wedgies can force a buyer to give ID to an EA if they choose not to.

However, the EA can always refuse to deal with the buyer, and/or advise their client (the seller) to find a more 'serious' buyer.

The buyer may well lose the property.


Having said that, the buyer could always circumvent the EA, and approach the seller directly. If he convinced the seller of his genuineness, and th seller decided to proceed, and instructed his solicitor to sell, then I don't see what the EA could do.

Surrey_EA

paranoidandroid31978 wrote: »

Yes that might be true but never the less look at what I'm saying and it's perfectly true. A person cannot be deemed suspicious if he gives those reasons and is already registered with a bricks and mortar solicitor as was my case.

I purchased a house from one of the largest chain estate agents in the country and they didn't bat an eyelid. I didn't even give them my personal information apart from name and address. NO date of birth and definitely no personal documentation. I have got a long term relationship with one of the best bricks and mortar solicitors in the area and they've known of my entire property buying history from start to finish so that helps.

The requirement for EAs to perform AML checks on buyers is relatively recent.

Countrywide are probably not a great barometer for correct standards!

p00hsticks

I'd say that all checks requested need to bear in mind that in this country it's not (as yet) illegal to fail to possess some form of government-issue photo ID.

Insisting on having to show any document (such as passport or photo driving licence) that it isn't compulsory for a citizen to have discriminates against sections of this society who may not possess them.

ReadingTim

Suck it up or find another dream home OP - choice is yours. And whatever far-fetched conspiracy theories you hold relating to identity theft are just as likely to strike your solicitor as they are a.n.other EA so you're going to have to get comfortable with it one way or another, or go full-on tinfoil hat brigade....