Raising a credit card dispute against John Lewis

TheLondoner

Hello,

I bought a laptop from John Lewis online, and I returned it but they are refusing to give me my money back because they are saying that I used it and it isn't in a new condition (I had to take off the cling film wrapping to test the item).

What I want to know is aren't consumers allowed to return items bought off the internet under the distance selling regulations? I understand there are exemptions like software (if licence is used) or underwear (hygiene), but laptops? Are we as consumers allowed to return laptops under our rights under the distance selling regs? Are there any situations where it does not apply?

I filed a dispute with my credit card company. If anyone here has raised a dispute can you talk me through the process after the dispute has been raised please?

Are there any statistics on what %age are successfully fought etc? Getting a bit stressed about this!

[Deleted User]

Other people's experiences and stats won't help you. It depends on your situation.

Section 75 gives you the same rights are the card provider as the retailer.

What are the reasons you're returning it? You'd probably be better off posting on the Consumer Rights board.

TheLondoner

Laptop was faulty, but I just told them I wanted to return it without giving a reason because I assumed I had the right under the distance selling regs (and thought it'd be faster). Now they've rejected it I've told them it was also faulty to see if that helps, but not holding my hopes up! What a saga it is becoming!

eskbanker

TheLondoner wrote: »

I bought a laptop from John Lewis online, and I returned it but they are refusing to give me my money back because they are saying that I used it and it isn't in a new condition (I had to take off the cling film wrapping to test the item).

If your testing unearthed a fault with the laptop then you should indeed be able to get a refund or replacement.

However, if after testing it, you simply changed your mind without there being a fault then you're on much weaker ground - their policy is spelt out at https://www.johnlewis.com/customer-services/returns/our-refund-policy, stating that you need to "return your item unused and in original condition (as it was received by you)" if it's just unwanted rather than faulty.

This doesn't override any statutory rights but you'll need to prove they've breached their terms (or the law) if you want to make a successful claim against John Lewis or your card company.

Edit: now seen your update, if it's faulty then their policy says they'll refund or exchange so all should be good if the fault is clear and reproducible....

Red-Squirrel_2

TheLondoner wrote: »

Laptop was faulty, but I just told them I wanted to return it without giving a reason because I assumed I had the right under the distance selling regs (and thought it'd be faster). Now they've rejected it I've told them it was also faulty to see if that helps, but not holding my hopes up! What a saga it is becoming!

In my experience of John Lewis, if you'd just told them straightaway it was faulty they would have replaced it with no quibbles.

eco_warrior

You can’t really expext to return goods that have become faulty without declaring it. As soon as there’s an issue it’s not a “change of heart” situation.

John Lewis are pretty good so hopefully they sort it for you. If your bank wants to dispute it they will likely ask you to supply independent evidence to confirm the faults.

As an aside, distant selling doesn’t come under the umbrella of s75 or chargeback

System

eco_warrior wrote: »

You can’t really expect to return goods that have become faulty without declaring it. As soon as there’s an issue it’s not a “change of heart” situation.

John Lewis are pretty good so hopefully they sort it for you. If your bank wants to dispute it they will likely ask you to supply independent evidence to confirm the faults.

As an aside, distant selling doesn’t come under the umbrella of s75 or chargeback

With the distance selling regs, you do have "change of heart" rights as you never had a chance to inspect the goods. The regs do actually fall under both chargeback and S75 as they are part of the purchase.

eskbanker

Heng_Leng wrote: »

eco_warrior wrote: »

[...]

As an aside, distant selling doesn’t come under the umbrella of s75 or chargeback

With the distance selling regs, you do have "change of heart" rights as you never had a chance to inspect the goods. The regs do actually fall under both chargeback and S75 as they are part of the purchase.

Not sure about the validity of trying to construct some sort of hierarchy here but distance selling rights (including cancellation) are now enshrined in the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013, which superseded the previous distance selling regulations in June 2014.

Section 75 relates to the Consumer Credit Act 1974, which holds credit providers jointly liable with merchants, typically applied to credit card purchases these days.

Chargeback is a non-statutory process operated by Visa and Mastercard, which can also be applied to debit card purchases.

There is of course other legislation applicable to retail purchases, such as [STRIKE]the Sale of Goods Act 1979[/STRIKE] the Consumer Rights Act 2015, but to me none of these 'falls under' any of the others, in that they're different instruments typically applied to different situations. If OP wanted to exercise 'change of heart' rights then this would need to be done by invoking the consumer contracts act, but if looking to claim breach of contract or misrepresentation it's generally most productive to take the matter up with the merchant first (potentially citing [STRIKE]SOGA[/STRIKE] CRA if necessary) rather than jumping straight to the card provider under CCA s75.

Edit: as rightly pointed out below, SOGA has been superseded by the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

agrinnall

eskbanker wrote: »

There is of course other legislation applicable to retail purchases, such as the Sale of Goods Act 1979, but to me none of these 'falls under' any of the others, in that they're different instruments typically applied to different situations. If OP wanted to exercise 'change of heart' rights then this would need to be done by invoking the consumer contracts act, but if looking to claim breach of contract or misrepresentation it's generally most productive to take the matter up with the merchant first (potentially citing SOGA if necessary) rather than jumping straight to the card provider under CCA s75.

For consumers SOGA no longer applies in most circumstances, the relevant legislation is the Consumer Rights Act 2015. Much of the provisions are the same but some have been strengthened.

CakeCrusader

It's tricky to return items like this (and cameras) once you've opened the packaging, which is why you're advised not to open it unless you are prepared to keep the item. Imagine going into a shop, buying a laptop, and then finding someone else's pictures in the docs or on the hard drive, you wouldn't be happy, would you, it's also a risk (say for example, the previous owner downloaded images of abuse, returned the laptop to the retailer, you buy it and take it into a repair shop for something and they find the images. Not good!!). If you'd have said it was faulty they would have sorted it without question, but you didn't.