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Alternative to saving in to pension?
Comments
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I'm currently saving into a personal pension (I'm self-employed). However I think when I come to retire in 20 years time the stock market will not be doing well (due to climate change). Is there an alternative to saving into a pension that is perhaps more robust to stock market / economic down turns?
Where did people best place their money in the great depression - or inflation in the Weimar Republic?
I posted a similiar question, but it has gone way off topic. I don't want to debate climate change, saving the world or my own views. I'd just simply like some financial advice given the above scenerio.
I read an article the other day which looked at how various investing classes fared after the 1929 crash. Stocks and shares were far better for recovering from the crash than property and gold. I'd post it here but I can't find it. In any case the market was much better than either of those alternative investments.
If you wanted to profit from climate change you could either invest in companies that would direct it profit from it, eg ones that make wind turbines, PV systems, recycling, electric cars and so forth. Or pick a fund that does this. Or just accept that over time as some companies did badly (let's say oil companies and companies that made diesel cars) others that did better, say Tesla and ones that make batteries, will replace them in the stock market indices so you'll be covered anyway .
In a world war you'd invest in armament companies and the like. So it seems irrational to me to say you think "the stock market" won't be doing well because unless civilisation goes away it will still be there just with different companies in it than today's. And if it does go away then gold or property will be worthless as well.
As to inflation, well the best thing would be to own a share of a company because that won't be affected by inflation, if you own 1% of Tesla (I wish) or in pre war Germany 1% of Krupp Armaments, you still own 1% even if the currency has inflated by 1000x. Which again speaks to the stock market.
So it's either that or as I said in your previous thread go self sufficient somewhere like the Orkney's, well away from the ravaging looting hordes because merely havinga bundle of cash or some gold bars won't help you in that scenario.0 -
Cash would have been a safe haven in the Great Depression in the short term. But cash (in marks) would have been the worst place possible during the hyperinflation of the Weimar republic. So what are you trying to protect against? A stock market crash or hyperinflation?Where did people best place their money in the great depression - or inflation in the Weimar Republic?
As everyone says, in the mid to long term the stock market beats everything given all of the unforseen shocks that have happened in the last century. 20 years is definitely mid to long term, so there are gains to be made in the stock market even if you believe climate change will cause issues in 20 years.
A well-diversified portfolio is the best insurance policy. If you are concerned about the stock market, then use lower-risk multi-asset funds with a greater bond exposure. As you get closer to retirement, convert your investments increasingly to cash (but then you run the risk of losing out to inflation).
IMO property won't be a bad long term investment. People always need somewhere to live and as sea levels rise and people migrate away from the areas most affected by climate change, demand for property in northern and southern parts of the world will go up. Just make sure (as I advised on your other thread) it is not in an area that could be underwater in the next 100 years. IMO I think rising sea levels are the most immediate threat that we have to worry about.0 -
On your last thread you were concerned that pensions would be worthless in 10 years, why have you pushed this doomsday scenario out by 10 years
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5927973/climate-change-pension-be-worthless-in-10-years
They know more than they are letting on about:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:0 -
However I think when I come to retire in 20 years time the stock market will not be doing well (due to climate change).
Why will the stock market be down? There might be companies investing to account for climate chnge. Such as caarbn reducing ones, builiding on mountains ones, buliding dykes ones (RE the Netherlands). Invet in forwar thinking.Where did people best place their money in the great depression -
Gold, property and currency in unaffected countries0 -
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What is the point of this duplicate thread when you are completely off your rockers and won't consider reason?
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5927973/climate-change-pension-be-worthless-in-10-yearsI am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). The comments I make are just my opinion and are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice and you should not treat them as such. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.0 -
Nothing will beat the stock market. Despite the huge amount of crashes and events such as:
the great depression
ww1
ww2
the cold war
vietnam
9/11
the dot com crash
the credit crunch of 2008
etc
etc
etc
etc
The market always recovers and always goes up.
Complete rubbish. How did the Austro-Hungarian stock market do? Or the Russian?Free the dunston one next time too.0 -
Complete rubbish. How did the Austro-Hungarian stock market do? Or the Russian?
Well those countries were pulverized , the only option for a clever ones was to emigrate before it kicked off and for less clever ones to try and cross the border by foot with gold coins in the lining of their coats so although not as catastrophic as the end of civilisation those are still pretty extreme examples.The word "dilemma" comes from Greek where "di" means two and "lemma" means premise. Refers usually to difficult choice between two undesirable options.
Often people seem to use this word mistakenly where "quandary" would fit better.0 -
Are that is a thought - it surely depends on where the property is. Anywhere say 100ft above sea level should be a geat investment once the flood plains and coastal cities are unundated, provided you could keep the property secure once the refugees start moving.
I would not think it would work in a country in which huge portion of the crucial territory happened to be under water with those inundated areas being just a couple of miles from that house - the mess resulting would not leave the inhabitants of the dry house unaffected. Emigrating into the territory which is going to stay above the water mostly may be the answer. Siberia , Canada and Tenerife if I remember correctly ? Any takers for Siberia?:DThe word "dilemma" comes from Greek where "di" means two and "lemma" means premise. Refers usually to difficult choice between two undesirable options.
Often people seem to use this word mistakenly where "quandary" would fit better.0 -
Where some see despair others will see opportunity.However I think when I come to retire in 20 years time the stock market will not be doing well (due to climate change).
Perhaps climate change will create new services or industries (ignoring the obvious potential human suffering for the moment).Personal Responsibility - Sad but True
Sometimes.... I am like a dog with a bone0
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