What to inform Council as sub tenant?

marythemoose

Hi, recently separated from partner & kids, so moved from renting a property (joint tenant, paying council tax) to renting a room in a house occupied by pensioner, who is himself renting the house (sub-tenant, bills included in rent, including council tax), all within the same council area.

Wanting to inform relevant parties of my change in circumstances, go to council website to change address details, start filling in online form re: council tax. Becomes clear that form is not set up for sub-tenants (asking me for details of all people living in property etc), abandon and ask current tenant-landlord what he thinks.

He gets very defensive and tells me council tax on this property is nothing to do with me, I mustn't contact the council.
Do I need to let council know I live here now? If I'm on the electoral register, is that enough? How do I ensure I'm not liable for anything?


Thanks in advance.

bouicca21

Is the pensioner getting single person's discount?

theartfullodger

£5 says he's not declaring his rent income from you: Which might well affect some of his benefits & explain why he is defensive. Sad, if true.


He the property-owner or tenant is responsible for council tax, and with more than one adult no longer qualifies for 25% single person's discount.



Feel free to inform council of whatever you like (email, letter etc..) but recognise that as a lodger you have very few rights and can be evicted on very short notice.



Do you have a written lodger agreement? Does he actually genuinely live there?

CIS

(sub-tenant, bills included in rent, including council tax),

Straight away this tells you there is something dodgy - except in certain specific and unusual situations the tenant who rents a whole property is responsible for payment of the council tax and not his landlord.

Do I need to let council know I live here now? If I'm on the electoral register, is that enough? How do I ensure I'm not liable for anything?

In respect of council tax discounts it is the liable party who is ultimately responsible for telling the council however if the council come up with your name as resident they would look in to any discounts. I would suggest you do however advise the council of your occupancy of the room to precent you getting caught up in any council tax issues.

Honeylife

marythemoose wrote: »

Hi, recently separated from partner & kids, so moved from renting a property (joint tenant, paying council tax) to renting a room in a house occupied by pensioner, who is himself renting the house (sub-tenant, bills included in rent, including council tax), all within the same council area.

Wanting to inform relevant parties of my change in circumstances, go to council website to change address details, start filling in online form re: council tax. Becomes clear that form is not set up for sub-tenants (asking me for details of all people living in property etc), abandon and ask current tenant-landlord what he thinks.

He gets very defensive and tells me council tax on this property is nothing to do with me, I mustn't contact the council.
Do I need to let council know I live here now? If I'm on the electoral register, is that enough? How do I ensure I'm not liable for anything?
.

To be fair it actually is his responsibility to inform the council of changes in his property as the Lead Tenant, this includes anyone who comes into (or leaves) the home. The main criteria the council look for is that it does not cause overcrowding.

If he has not informed the council after a reasonable amount of time then you can contact the electoral role department and make sure you are registered to vote etc. If you are paying rent you should get a rent book for a weekly payment or if you are paying online you can use that transaction as your receipt. I presume you do not have a Licence (Lodgers Agreement). You can purchase one of these from WH Smith or Ryman and encourage him to use it, therefore, you will have some legal paperwork.

He may loose his single person reduction on Council Tax but his other benefits e.g. possible Housing benefit are more complicated. He is allowed to earn £7,500 per annum tax-free and I think pensioners have other allowances involved but don't have that precise information to hand at moment. Still don't assume he is diddling the local authority. Many don't know what they should and shouldn't tell the council and he may just take umbrage at you going over his position as "homeowner" to discuss with others stuff that he thinks is his place to do so.

If you are uncomfortable paying him rent and NOT being registered with the Council - which is totally understandable - then look for somewhere else.

Teamocil

Is this a social housing property? If so, your moral obligations are different.

Slithery

CIS wrote: »

Straight away this tells you there is something dodgy - except in certain specific and unusual situations the tenant who rents a whole property is responsible for payment of the council tax and not his landlord.

Isn't that exactly what's happening though?

OP is a lodger and his landlord is renting the whole property and (hopefully) paying all of the council tax.

marythemoose

bouicca21 wrote: »

Is the pensioner getting single person's discount?

I don't think he is; he mentioned the other day about being able to claim that if he was here by himself, I don't think he'd bring it up otherwise. I wonder if maybe he's not declaring the rent we're paying him, and perhaps that's what it's about.

marythemoose

theartfullodger wrote: »

£5 says he's not declaring his rent income from you: Which might well affect some of his benefits & explain why he is defensive. Sad, if true.


He the property-owner or tenant is responsible for council tax, and with more than one adult no longer qualifies for 25% single person's discount.



Feel free to inform council of whatever you like (email, letter etc..) but recognise that as a lodger you have very few rights and can be evicted on very short notice.



Do you have a written lodger agreement? Does he actually genuinely live there?

All he's given me is a very basic single page confirming what the rent is, the address, etc.

[Deleted User]

If he is a subtenant, this means the actual person awarded the house is not living there. This breaks social housing rules (it must be the named tenants main residence) and if the council were informed, would lead to the actual tenant and the subtenant and yourself being evicted. Councils are quite strong about this now, due to the shortage of social housing. Presumably, the house, if let properly by the council, would be suitable for a homeless family stuck in B&B.

This is why the subtenant became defensive. But they obviously are aware that what they are doing breaks the original tenancy terms.

You don't have to register with the council, but I would be looking for somewhere where there wasn't a threat of eviction hanging over my head. Councils do do data checks. Even with you doing nothing, a random data check could very easily highlight the illegal tenancy that has been granted to the subtenant.

Ratkin007

Although you make reference to sub-tenant it is unclear if you class yourself as a sub-tenant or if you are renting from the tenant of the property or from a sub-tenant. If the pensioner is the tenant then you don't need to speak with Council Tax as he is liable for that. Being on electoral register is sufficient. There is no reason for you to know about his finances and whether or not he has informed Council Tax and HB if relevant. If, however pensioner is a sub-tenant then that is a different matter.