Been in our home since May...absolute house of horrors...

Crashy_Time

Davesnave wrote: »

There have always been people who 'get into difficulties.' Even Michael Jackson managed it.

You don`t really think that the economic outlook and landscape, especially regarding debt burdens, is the same for households now and since the early 2000`s as it was in the 70`s 80`s or 90`s?

moneyistooshorttomention

That is actually a valid point.

Certainly in the 1970s and still so in the 1980s was "There might be a better-paid job along in a minute that I can apply for" and there was certainly "There might be some opportunity outside of main jobs along in a minute that I can ask for".

I do know that from personal experience - as various opportunities for extra money came along at intervals.

This century - for the whole century so far I'm trying to think back to when the last chance at a bit extra money came along and it was certainly over 10 years ago personally.

I suspect chances of "a bit extra" to help out are much rarer than they were/now non-existent for many....

One can also sympathise with the fact that many people haven't had their annual cost of living rises for some years. Those of us who have had these rises - well they've not matched inflation. So those sort of things are largely outside our personal control.

ViolaLass

MaMoneyMaMoney wrote: »

My previous comment was in response to the following and related comments prior to that

Saying nothing isn't the same as lying.


OP, we had to get our roof 'fixed' 3 times. First time, done well, turned out the bit they'd identified wasn't the whole problem but at least it was better.

Second time, first guys were busy and we got a cowboy. Luckily he didn't leave it any worse, just wasted our money.

Third time, problem apparently actually solved.

House now sold, thank god. I don't miss it at all.

Davesnave

Crashy_Time wrote: »

You don`t really think that the economic outlook and landscape, especially regarding debt burdens, is the same for households now and since the early 2000`s as it was in the 70`s 80`s or 90`s?

And you shouldn't think individuals make their financial decisions on the basis of their neighbours' debts, because that's not how people behave.

Plenty of opportunities out there for the skilled, money. I don't lie awake at night worrying about how my children will cope, because they have transferable skills and that mysterious extra thing, drive.

Can't say about my neighbours' kids. Some of them seem to be somewhat idle, have an entitled attitude and a few I know are very much indebted, whereas mine have never been out of work since they were 14.

Davesnave

ViolaLass wrote: »

Saying nothing isn't the same as lying.

Especially when one isn't living there and has left inspection to the tender mercies of the person offering, their family and and their surveyor, if there was one.

Crashy_Time

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

That is actually a valid point.

Certainly in the 1970s and still so in the 1980s was "There might be a better-paid job along in a minute that I can apply for" and there was certainly "There might be some opportunity outside of main jobs along in a minute that I can ask for".

I do know that from personal experience - as various opportunities for extra money came along at intervals.

This century - for the whole century so far I'm trying to think back to when the last chance at a bit extra money came along and it was certainly over 10 years ago personally.

I suspect chances of "a bit extra" to help out are much rarer than they were/now non-existent for many....

One can also sympathise with the fact that many people haven't had their annual cost of living rises for some years. Those of us who have had these rises - well they've not matched inflation. So those sort of things are largely outside our personal control.

The change 15 or so years ago was that the "bit extra" (Very big bit in many cases) came from loans and credit cards for the most part, this and the growing property bubble with it`s feel good HPI factor :j :rotfl: hid the fact from most people that wages and job opportunity was stagnating as the bankers made out like bandits. Unfortunately debt bubbles need very low rates, political stability (and leaders on-side with the bankers) and lately central bank co-ordination to stay pumped. None of those factors can be taken for granted now

Crashy_Time

Davesnave wrote: »

And you shouldn't think individuals make their financial decisions on the basis of their neighbours' debts, because that's not how people behave.

Plenty of opportunities out there for the skilled, money. I don't lie awake at night worrying about how my children will cope, because they have transferable skills and that mysterious extra thing, drive.

Can't say about my neighbours' kids. Some of them seem to be somewhat idle, have an entitled attitude and a few I know are very much indebted, whereas mine have never been out of work since they were 14.

?? The point was that MORE people are MORE in debt than ever before, very small rate hikes will affect a lot of people. Lots of people on property forums like talking about the 15% interest rates as if it has relevance to todays economy/property market, it doesn`t, and pretending it does is misleading and poor advice for todays buyers IMO.

moneyistooshorttomention

Crashy_Time wrote: »

The change 15 or so years ago was that the "bit extra" (Very big bit in many cases) came from loans and credit cards for the most part, this and the growing property bubble with it`s feel good HPI factor :j :rotfl: hid the fact from most people that wages and job opportunity was stagnating as the bankers made out like bandits. Unfortunately debt bubbles need very low rates, political stability (and leaders on-side with the bankers) and lately central bank co-ordination to stay pumped. None of those factors can be taken for granted now

That much is true.

Though many of us got "a bit extra" from things like second jobs (maybe not available any longer), lodgers (maybe we can't take having a stranger in our house any more), carpet-bagging with something or other (eg opening building society accounts we didn't actually want per se), etc, etc.

Davesnave

Crashy_Time wrote: »

?? The point was that MORE people are MORE in debt than ever before, very small rate hikes will affect a lot of people. Lots of people on property forums like talking about the 15% interest rates as if it has relevance to todays economy/property market, it doesn`t, and pretending it does is misleading and poor advice for todays buyers IMO.

Excuse me, but it was at the start of this thread that I suggested it's good not to max out and to have a contingency fund. That's advice.


I don't recall giving any other advice.

Crashy_Time

Davesnave wrote: »

I never claimed that. It was you who suggested that a problem or two with the plumbing could be resolved by upping sticks.

I remember interest rates @ 15%. We still paid the mortgage and wages climbed to compensate. Prices followed suit, so debt was inflated away.

But we are rather far away from 15% at present!

I said that people repeat myths about renting to make themselves feel better about heavy mortgage and other debt loads in a rising rate environment - you responded with the bit in bold, which reads to me as if you are saying that everything is alright with todays property market and mortgage/personal debt obligations because look how much worse it could be/we had it! My response, as previously stated was that the two era`s are not comparable in economic terms because people are just much more indebted nowadays, and don`t have 70`s style inflation driven pay rises every week.