PCN - car was not actually where they claim it was

reysham

Hi,

A friend has received a PCN claiming that the car was driven in a no-entry area...in a different city altogether. The keeper has not been to this city since having purchased the car under two weeks ago. The images on the letter show a similar coloured vehicle, with no evidence of number plate, etc. (which they surely can't have since, as i've mentioned, the car has NOT even been in the alleged city since date of purchase).

Keeper can prove non-possibility simply by showing images of mileage car has done since purchase - and as all the driving has been local, the mileage proves that there is no way that the car could have travelled the required number of miles to the alleged site of 'contravention'.

In addition, as far as I can gauge, the PCN is from a council.

What to do?
Many thanks.

Fruitcake

You would be better asking your questions on pepipoo.com as they are the council and police motoring experts, whereas we deal primarily with private parking charges here on MSE.

You will need to register on pepipoo with a non-Hotmail email address, then read the FAQs before posting.

Good luck.

reysham

Ok many thanks,

Wish me luck.

Coupon-mad

You don't need it except if this car is a clone...or if there is a clone out there.

A big headache if so, and the DVLA will need telling to flag the vehicle clone situation on their records and stop giving out your data (as it's not your car) or allow a change of VRN.

reysham

Well this is not annoying!

While the PCN from London Borough is being dealt with (ref: on forum suggested above, but I'm unsure if it's prudent to link here due to additional info below), my friend has now received a PCN from Parking Eye.

The council PCN was dated 25.10.2018 and the Parking Eye one is dated 28.10.2018; both in ilford. As the car is registered to a keeper living in the North of the country, and mileage from date of purchase (on purchase papers from dealership) and 31.10.2018 (photographed and timestamped) is less than distance between keeper's home and site of either infraction, what is the best defence?

Should the keeper:
- follow the advice for private PCN, i.e. appeal denying liability?
- appeal citing possible/probable cloning and link to police report/crime number/ref (which friend is currently in the process of obtaining)?
- another course of action?

I reread this and the details seem as clear as mud, but I really don't want to note something which could cause legal issues later on - please let me know if I should be more clear, and in what regard.

Many thanks

Coupon-mad

Should the keeper:
- appeal citing possible/probable cloning and link to police report/crime number/ref (which friend is currently in the process of obtaining)?

Do the above but they don't get a CRIME Number, they get an Incident Number. That goes to both PCN issuers, as evidence.

Please search the forum for CLONED as your keyword because there are threads going into detail about what I already advised the person WILL need to do:

the DVLA will need telling to flag the vehicle clone situation on their records and stop giving out your data (as it's not your car) or allow a change of VRN.

Please do that forum search for that keyword (ADVANCED SEARCH, this forum only!).

Most worrying will be, if your friend's vehicle IS the clone! I doubt it, I expect the cloners copied the VRN from the seller's advert photos or something...

reysham

I read your advice for another user regarding cloning, and I hope you don't mind, but I used the letter you suggested as a template for the following:

Dear DVLA and BPA,

Issue re - cloned plates - VRN xxx xxxx and London Borough of Redbridge and PrivateEye obtaining my data wrongly

I have had two letters through from the London Borough of Redbridge and PrivateEye about infractions in Ilford, London on 25.10.2018 and 28.10.2018. I can categorically state that I have not been in the city of London, and therefore Ilford by extension since the purchase and possession of my vehicle on 22.10.2018.
Recorded mileage of my vehicle proves that I cannot have driven to or from the site/s of infraction over the course of the 4 days as the required mileage to cover the distance between my home and the site/s, and the various places that I visited to complete work/personal chores has not been covered. i.e. I would have been required to have driven over 800 miles in the course of the four days; between 22.10.2018 and 31.10.2018, my car is recorded to have covered a distance less than 200 miles.

See pictures of odometer from purchase papers dated 22.10.2018 and attached timestamped screenshot of picture taken of odometer on 31.10.2018.

I also have witnessed who can confirm that I was tutoring a student at 8pm on 25.10.2018, and cameras on the M1 can attest to the fact that my vehicle did not speed down the motorway recklessly, as this is the only way in which I could have reached the site of the first infraction in time to complete it.

BPA, how do I get this removed by PrivateEye and the London Borough of Redbridge, as I can't really 'appeal' as it's not my car that has caused the infractions?

Both PCNs attached so you can see the PCN refs.

DVLA, what can you do to resolve this - a flag on my data not to release it due to the VRN cloning? Do you need an Incident Number from London Met. Police?
Yours Sincerely,

Is the above OK?

Coupon-mad

PrivateEye

What, did you have Ian Hislop write to you then?!!

Yes you can copy that as a start, then do whatever the DVLA want in order to get this sorted. I hope they will allocate the car a new VRN.

KeithP

Ilford and the London Borough of Redbridge are not in the City of London.

"I also have witnessed..." should be "I also have witnesses...".

Can you break up the sentence starting "Recorded mileage of my vehicle..."?
It is too long to read and understand.

Leave out the bit about cameras on the M1 unless you have proof of that negative issue.

reysham

Oops - ParkingEye

Ok, I'll look at an edit

Thanks

reysham

Dear DVLA and BPA,

Issue re - cloned plates - VRN xxx xxxx and London Borough of Redbridge and ParkingEye obtaining my data wrongly

I have had two letters through from the London Borough of Redbridge and ParkingEye about infractions in Ilford, London on 25.10.2018 and 28.10.2018. I can categorically state that I have not been in the city of London, and therefore Ilford by extension since the purchase and possession of my vehicle on 22.10.2018.
Recorded mileage of my vehicle proves that I cannot have driven to or from the site/s of infraction over the course of the 4 days. Between 22.10.2018 and 31.10.2018, I can provide evidence that my vehicle travelled a distance less than 200 miles; I would have been required to have driven over 800 miles in the course of the four days in order to visit the site/s of the infractions, and complete chores in my hometown.

See pictures of odometer from purchase papers dated 22.10.2018 and attached timestamped screenshot of picture taken of odometer on 31.10.2018.

I also have witnesses who can confirm that I was tutoring a student at 8pm on 25.10.2018.

BPA, how do I get this removed by ParkingEye and the London Borough of Redbridge, as I can't really 'appeal' as it's not my car that has caused the infractions?

Both PCNs attached so you can see the PCN refs.

DVLA, what can you do to resolve this - a flag on my data not to release it due to the VRN cloning? Do you need an Incident Number from London Met. Police?
Yours Sincerely,

What do you think? Does the second paragraph make more sense now?