Obtaining consent for extension in share of freehold

bouicca21

MarianeJ wrote: »

The patio (and garden) is our own, not the freehold; they only own the load bearing walls basically

I think you have got it wrong. The freeholder owns the land the block sits on as well as the patio, you have a lease on it. Your lease also specifies what you can and can't do to the walls since if you did something daft the block could collapse.

I similarly 'own' the bit of garden to the front and back of my flat - that is, they are bundled into my lease. It would be very odd if the freehold of the garden were somehow separate to the freehold of the building.

Tom99

MarianeJ wrote: »

The patio (and garden) is our own, not the freehold; they only own the load bearing walls basically. And yes actually considering that the covenant only refers to the internal part, technically, we dont need their consent as long as we dont touch the structure and dont make an addition inside the freehold s demise, right?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Probably wrong. The patio will be part of your demise and is leasehold.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]You quoted the covenant wording “Not to make any structural alterations or additions to the Flat”[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Flat with a capital 'F'. Is Flat a defined term in the lease? If so what does it say?[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Even if the word Flat is not defined, its reasonable to assume the term Flat, in the context of the lease, refers to all that area leased, both inside and out.[/FONT]

MarianeJ

Hi Tom99,
No, the patio is ours, neither the neighbours’ nor our lawyer raised anything about it, it’s not in our lease. The limitation of the demise are drawn on the plan.

bouicca21

So you own the freehold of the land on which the patio is built? Or is that area part of the shared freehold? What does the title plan for the shared freehold say? Just because no one objected to it does not mean the land belongs to you.

MarianeJ

Thanks for replying bouicca21,
Yes we own the land outside the freehold's demise.
The lease describes our demise, the Flat, as including:
- all drains pipes solely serving the Flat
- all windows and frames and all internal non-load bearing walls
- the linings and surfaces of the interior of all walls
- the ceiling & other surfaces (excl floor and ceiling joists)
- the garden and ground (as marked on the plan)

MarianeJ

I call it patio but it's part of the garden, the level is just lower than the garden

bouicca21

I'm confused. In #14, You said it wasn't in your lease. Now you say #16 garden and ground as in the lease and the accompanying plan.

AdrianC

MarianeJ wrote: »

Yes we own the land outside the freehold's demise.
The lease describes our demise, the Flat, as including:
- all drains pipes solely serving the Flat
- all windows and frames and all internal non-load bearing walls
- the linings and surfaces of the interior of all walls
- the ceiling & other surfaces (excl floor and ceiling joists)
- the garden and ground (as marked on the plan)

I think you're getting confused about freehold and leasehold.

Leasehold - somebody else owns the ground and the shell of the building. You have a very long lease to use it and live there under the terms of the lease. You may pay as little as one peppercorn per year rent (which might not be asked for), you may pay considerably more.

Freehold - you own the ground and the building.


You may well own the lease plus a share in the company that owns the freehold.

If you have a leasehold flat, plus a share in the freehold company, PLUS the freehold over your patio, then you own three very separate things.

MarianeJ

Sorry,hard to get the wording right
What i meant is that the freehold s demise is the flat structure, nothing outside of that

davidmcn

MarianeJ wrote: »

Sorry,hard to get the wording right
What i meant is that the freehold s demise is the flat structure, nothing outside of that

I think it's more likely that the freeholder's demise is the whole development. You possibly mean that the only part which hasn't been leased is the structural components of the building, but I'm not sure why that's relevant.