Chargeback query

GlamGirlie

Hi.
I recently purchased a porcelain 'ginger jar' for c.£60. When it arrived, I opened it to find it broken.

I have called, Tweeted and emailed the retailer (Shabby Store) but am resolutely ignored.

I have contacted my card provider, First Direct, to request a chargeback, but they are insisting I post/courier the jar back and give them proof I have done so.

However this must be at my own cost!! The jar is bigger than my almost-4 year old and weighs several kilos. It will cost a fortune :mad:

Surely this isn't right?

The MSE page on chargebacks doesn't mention returning the item either way.

Thanks.

Terry_Towelling

Can only advise on old knowledge, so others may have more up to date info.

However, Visa rules used to say the item must have been returned to the retailer with a request for refund/replacement before a Chargeback for 'defective Merchandise' could be done. You are advised to obtain proof of return (and proof of receipt by the retailer).

MasterCard rules used to say the Cardholder must have 'tendered return'. That is different as it just means you have to have offered to return the goods. The rules may have changed since my days though.

You are within your rights to ask the retailer to fork out for the return cost (if they don't ignore you) but any Chargeback will be limited to the transaction amount at most.

The reason for this requirement is that you cannot retain the value of the item (even though broken) and have your money back as well - and this also applies to the retailer who cannot have the goods back and the money for them too.

This Chargeback rule was hard won by Visa card issuers back in the 1990s because retailers and their processing banks didn't feel it was appropriate for card dispute rules to encroach on contractual issues between customer and supplier - and there were often disputes as to when/how the item was broken. I think MasterCard had their Chargeback right a bit earlier which is partly why Visa went for it, to have the same offering as their main competitor

Getting a Chargeback right in place required the support of all Visa/MasterCard member banks (with voting rights) or they never got put in place at all. As you may imagine, card issuers were happy to have it but retailer processing-banks were not because they then had the hard job of passing the loss onto their retailer.

GlamGirlie

Hi. Thanks.

I completely get I can't have my cake and eat it, as it were, but I object to paying what will probably amount to half the total cost of the item just to return it!

It is a Visa card, so it looks like I'm stuck unless I can get the retailer to respond.

What a nightmare.....

Thanks for replying though.

eco_warrior

Terry_Towelling wrote: »

Can only advise on old knowledge, so others may have more up to date info.

However, Visa rules used to say the item must have been returned to the retailer with a request for refund/replacement before a Chargeback for 'defective Merchandise' could be done. You are advised to obtain proof of return (and proof of receipt by the retailer).

MasterCard rules used to say the Cardholder must have 'tendered return'. That is different as it just means you have to have offered to return the goods. The rules may have changed since my days though.

You are within your rights to ask the retailer to fork out for the return cost (if they don't ignore you) but any Chargeback will be limited to the transaction amount at most.

The reason for this requirement is that you cannot retain the value of the item (even though broken) and have your money back as well - and this also applies to the retailer who cannot have the goods back and the money for them too.

This Chargeback rule was hard won by Visa card issuers back in the 1990s because retailers and their processing banks didn't feel it was appropriate for card dispute rules to encroach on contractual issues between customer and supplier - and there were often disputes as to when/how the item was broken. I think MasterCard had their Chargeback right a bit earlier which is partly why Visa went for it, to have the same offering as their main competitor

Getting a Chargeback right in place required the support of all Visa/MasterCard member banks (with voting rights) or they never got put in place at all. As you may imagine, card issuers were happy to have it but retailer processing-banks were not because they then had the hard job of passing the loss onto their retailer.

No they are still the same so everything you have posted is spot on.


Visa is a pain when it comes to faulty/damaged goods, for the customer anyway.

eskbanker

As you say, pursuing the retailer is probably the only way to cover return costs - https://shabbystore.co.uk/returns does state:

In the unlikely event that your item has arrived damaged or faulty, please email contact@shabbystore.co.uk with your order number, photographic evidence of damaged product(s) and if you would like a replacement or a refund. We will then arrange to collect the damaged item and send a replacement (If requested).

so they do seem to accept the principle of liability for return costs even if actually getting them to stick to this isn't as straightforward as it should be.

Perhaps worth writing to them by recorded delivery if other channels haven't borne fruit yet? It's maybe premature to start down the Letter Before Action route at this stage but ultimately it's your right to have a refund or replacement if the goods were damaged on arrival, even if it takes a trip to small claims to enforce this....

Samsung_Note2

Go on any website such as Parcel monkey ect and select Hermes or similar...can normally send 20/25kg and only costs £10/£12.

Ive sent a pair of 12" mini wheels with tyres...only costs about £15 and the female courier nearly popped a blood vessel they were that heavy.