money mules

BlackBird75

I recently got to know of someone involved in the "money mule" scam.

On looking into it further, it seems the government and the banks aren't really doing a lot to tackle this problem. It seems anyone can just open a bank account and have money transferred in by fraudsters. There seems to be no element of common sense applied by the banks.

For example, in this case the mule was a young girl on benefits, yet the bank didn't seem to apply any kind of system to stop money being transferred in to her account from elderly wealthy folk living miles away, who were being scammed by push payment fraudsters. It seems to be a one size fits all computer system.

Nothing actually happened to this girl who was a mule. She just got a warning. Not sure how her benefits are paid now. Maybe a cheque to be cashed at a money shop?

Anyway, the system seems impersonal and lacking in common sense.

Is it possible to stop those at risk of being scammed from using internet banking? Can you set it up so that payment should only be authorised in a branch?

dealer_wins

Its 2018, how anyone still falls for these scams amazes me.

So many warnings, stories in the news etc about it but people still fall for it.

BlackBird75

dealer_wins wrote: »

Its 2018, how anyone still falls for these scams amazes me.

So many warnings, stories in the news etc about it but people still fall for it.

Well the fraudsters adapt quickly. I read about a senior police officer and a solicitor both being scammed. It's not just old folk or simpletons.

There is suspicion that bank staff are involved, either "off duty" or recently employed.
The scams involving broadband providers involve the fraudsters somehow getting access to the router to control which lights flash and when.

worried_jim

There is absolutely no way "she just got a warning". She will have had her account closed down and a CIFAS fraud marker against her for the next six years making it impossible for her to open a bank account (and quite rightly so).

jimjames

BlackBird75 wrote: »

On looking into it further, it seems the government and the banks aren't really doing a lot to tackle this problem. It seems anyone can just open a bank account and have money transferred in by fraudsters. There seems to be no element of common sense applied by the banks.

But the problem is that money isn't transferred in by fraudsters. It's transferred by the gullible who have been scammed. How can you tell the transfers between bank accounts are legit or fraud. All transfers are based on account & sort code, there is no name check so if I move money between my accounts I certainly would get annoyed if every transfer was flagged as fraud because it was high value or matched some mark.

What exactly do you propose as common sense? You can't receive any money unless you're already rich? The bigger problem is the people who fall for the fake job adverts and those who fall for the fake car sales or whatever item is advertised below real price to draw the punters in.

coyrls

BlackBird75 wrote: »

Well the fraudsters adapt quickly. I read about a senior police officer and a solicitor both being scammed. It's not just old folk or simpletons.

There is suspicion that bank staff are involved, either "off duty" or recently employed.
The scams involving broadband providers involve the fraudsters somehow getting access to the router to control which lights flash and when.

What benefit would fraudsters gain by controlling which lights flash and when on a router?

BlackBird75

coyrls wrote: »

What benefit would fraudsters gain by controlling which lights flash and when on a router?

It convinces the victim of the fraud that the caller is actually from the broadband provider.
How do they do it?
Either a hack or an inside job...?

BlackBird75

worried_jim wrote: »

There is absolutely no way "she just got a warning". She will have had her account closed down and a CIFAS fraud marker against her for the next six years making it impossible for her to open a bank account (and quite rightly so).

But no prison sentence.

BlackBird75

jimjames wrote: »

But the problem is that money isn't transferred in by fraudsters.
What exactly do you propose as common sense? You can't receive any money unless you're already rich?

Yes. Different levels of bank account.
Why does someone on benefits need to be able to receive transfers in from other accounts, that are not pre authorised?

All they really need is to receive their benefit money and pay out utilities etc.
Anything else can be done by cheque or pre arranged in the branch etc.

Likewise, why does an elderly person need to have the ability to make these payments to other private citizens?

AnotherJoe

BlackBird75 wrote: »

Yes. Different levels of bank account.
Why does someone on benefits need to be able to receive transfers in from other accounts, that are not pre authorised?

All they really need is to receive their benefit money and pay out utilities etc.
Anything else can be done by cheque or pre arranged in the branch etc.

Likewise, why does an elderly person need to have the ability to make these payments to other private citizens?

Are you for real?

BlackBird75

It seems to me that banking has become almost like a large monopolist utility. Almost everyone is forced to use it and comply. It's also much too close to the government.
Why is it free?
Is the next stage a completely cashless system with negative interest rates imposed?