Subsidence issues

GemQuin

Hi,

My builder told me the other day that he thinks I have subsidence in my house - large cracks have started appearing around the window.

Should I contact the insurance company straight away or get an independent surveyor/structural engineer to come and have a look first? I called a structural engineer and he said it was £800 for an assessment! Presume a surveyor would be cheaper?

I'm worried that if it isn't subsidence the insurance company will still say I've made a claim on subsidence and then put up my payments (and also if I try to sell it this would be an issue?)

Any advice? Thanks in advance.

SmashedAvacado

If your insurance requires you to notify, then you should notify because you may be insured for putting the issue right and by not notifying you might be invalidating your insurance. Check what your policy wording says before doing anything. If you are insured for this risk, you can just say that the builder has said that he thinks that there is a risk but he's not an expert so you need their guidance on next steps.

I should add that most policies would only cover putting right damage caused but you should check because all policies are different.

FreeBear

What is the age of the house, and have the windows been replaced (may be with uPVC) ?

Some photos would help in pointing you in the right direction. Not all cracks are due to subsidence and you don't want to be flagging up nonexistent problems with the insurers.

eddddy

In your position, I wouldn't contact your insurers yet.

As you suggest, if you contact your insurers and it turns out not to be subsidence - you might still be left with a 'subsidence related claim' recorded by the insurer, which might affect future premiums.

(If your insurer sends somebody to look at it, your insurer will have to pay their fees, and so they might treat that as a claim - even if they don't find any subsidence.)

Again, as you suggest, ask a structural engineer to inspect - but £800 seems very expensive. Maybe phone around engineers, and make it clear that, at this stage, you just want a visual inspection, and verbal advice on whether to contact your insurers.


(FWIW, I can't see any risk of you invalidating your policy, because you ask a professional for advice before making a claim.)

GemQuin

Thank you. Yes my concern was flagging it to Insurance if it's not necessary. Thus I wanted a second opinion before calling them. If it is found to be subsidence then I will of course contact them and get them to do a full structural survey.
Yes the house is an old Edwardian townhouse circa 1902. Windows have indeed been replaced with uPVC (before we moved in). Could this be a cause? Will try to find some photos (or take some later).
Thanks again!

FreeBear

GemQuin wrote: »

Yes the house is an old Edwardian townhouse circa 1902. Windows have indeed been replaced with uPVC (before we moved in). Could this be a cause?

Older properties often used timber to support the brickwork above the windows. Some of these so called "professional" window installers would rip out the timber and fail to put any additional support in. Consequently, cracks would form above the windows. In some cases, this cracking can be quite serious, but even then, it can be repaired (not cheap work though).

I'm currently viewing a Victorian property that has a massive crack running up the rear wall - Some 10mm wide at the base. The cause is down to a failed wooden lintel over a doorway and not subsidence. Even so, it is going to be very expensive to fix as the wall will require jacking up before a new steel can be inserted. Unfortunately, the work is not covered by insurance as the timber has rotted due to a lack of maintenance.

eddddy

GemQuin wrote: »

TWindows have indeed been replaced with uPVC (before we moved in). Could this be a cause?

If structural window frames were replaced by non-structural window frames, that could cause cracking.

(e.g. The house originally had strong wooden window frames that helped support the brickwork above them, and they were replaced with lightweight uPVC frames that cannot support the weight.)


Going back to possible subsidence - if the house has been standing OK since 1902, something must have changed more recently to cause subsidence.

Are there any large trees nearby?
Have any large trees nearby recently been cut down?
Is there an underground drain near the cracked wall (which could be leaking)?

GemQuin

Ok, so the the window thing is definitely possible then. (This sounds better than subsidence or is it?).

There is a tree about 6 metres away from the front of the bay window (where the cracks are). It's about 3 storey's high, so not huge but large enough. Not sure about drains - how do I find this out?

Thanks for all suggestions. I think I might get a surveyor in as they appear to be much cheaper than structural engineers - and if they think it is subsidence or something else structural will go through insurance.

eddddy

GemQuin wrote: »

Ok, so the the window thing is definitely possible then. (This sounds better than subsidence or is it?).

Depends how you look at it. If the uPVC windows are the issue, it won't be covered by buildings insurance, so you'll have to pay - but your house won't have the stigma of a subsidence claim.

GemQuin wrote: »

There is a tree about 6 metres away from the front of the bay window (where the cracks are). It's about 3 storey's high, so not huge but large enough.

That sounds like a big tree! If the soil is clay, with limited rain and a hot summer, that's certainly a possible cause of subsidence.

FreeBear

eddddy wrote: »

That sounds like a big tree! If the soil is clay, with limited rain and a hot summer, that's certainly a possible cause of subsidence.

Trees and clay soils will cause heave & shrinkage - A different problem to subsidence which is (generally) down to voids appearing under, or very close to the foundations.

parking_question_chap

Photos would help.

Taking out metal/wooden windows and replacing with UPVC and no lintel is actually quite common.

In addition its not uncommon to see cracks under the centre of large windows which can be caused by difference in loading between the centre of the opening and the sides.