Landlord is sabotaging onwards house move

Pixie5740

If the previous fixed term was ended early then it was surrendered. Your options were to continue with the fixed term despite your flatmate moving out because the tenancy was not conditional on his continued occupation of the property and got yourself a lodger or agree to whatever terms the landlord wanted to end the tenancy early. You picked the latter. It's all water under the bridge now and you are where you are with your cunning plan on how to proceed.

You might get away with using your parents as a reference. It depends how slack the next landlord/letting agents are when referencing you as a prospective tenant.

This all said, the current landlord hasn't actually refused to surrender the tenancy or vary it, nor has the other landlord point black refused to accept you as a tenant so you could be getting your knickers in a twist over nothing.

saajan_12

nearlynomadic wrote: »

Unfortunately there's no break clause. The LL did, however, in an email state that he would consider a new tenant so long as they met his criteria. Subsequently, tenants were found that did meet his criteria. - "he would consider" is very different to accepting any one who meets the criteria. The LL's full preferences cannot be summarised in a list of fixed criteria, some other objections may come up based on the actual person. Crucially for you, the LL's statement doesn't sound like a firm agreement to surrender the tenancy, just that you could discuss.

When my flatmate emigrated, I was told that the LL wouldn't do a deed of variation, as I suggested, and would only accept a new 12 month AST. - okay, the LL doesn't have to accept anything so a new 12 month is better than nothing. I was then in an impossible situation where I was already bound to one AST (6 months in at that point), but was told I had to sign a new joint 12 month AST. I'm not sure what else I was meant to do - I couldn't walk away from the tenancy as I was still in the fixed term, and didn't want to move at that point, and needed a new flatmate to move in because the old one was on another continent, and having a new flatmate required me to sign a new 12 month AST. - you could have remained on the existing AST, either ensuring the emigrated tenant pays or paying the full rent yourself. You could have taken in a lodger to generate extra income.

I've offered the new LA
a) a reference from my previous LL
b) a guarantor
c) additional rent paid upfront

I'm waiting to hear back if any are acceptable to them. They've also had a reference from my employer.

I've spoken to other tenants of the same LL and while some have not tried to contact him in the last few weeks, others have had the same problem. I don't think that this is the LL fundamentally refusing to give a reference, I think that he's not responding to anyone at all. The LL's relatives (children?) help him to manage the properties, so even if he'd died I would have thought that they would be sorting this stuff out. - there's nothing he or his children HAVE to sort out though.. you have a house in good repair. You're asking for a favour, he doesn't have to give you the time of day.



That's the idea - to be evicted for not paying rent, because I don't want to live here any more. If I lose my next property, my plan would be to
a) stop paying rent
b) await section 8
c) move out, back to parental home
d) start looking for new property to rent, giving parents as my current landlords - if they accept that.. but then you could just look for a new property now who will accept less than rigorous
references.
e) keep unpaid rent in a savings account, so that if I was taken to court I could pay then and there and avoid a CCJ or other harm to my credit rating - last I heard renting doesn't count towards your credit rating.- you'd also be liable for all court fees and eviction costs. Plus depending on when you pay, you could still end up with a CCJ marked as 'Satisfied'. While that's much better than an unpaid CCJ, it could still be visible on credit history. That's what counts, not a made up rating.

nearlynomadic wrote: »

If you have any other bright ideas of getting the landlord to release me from an agreement when I have been most reasonable, please do enlighten me. - sorry, it is not reasonable to expect to unilatterally back out of an agreement you willingly made and blame the LL. At the moment, all I can see is me being trapped into a chain of overlapping 12 months ASTs when other tenants move in and out - so this would be a recurring issue. I'll note that, had my old flatmate not emigrated, I would now be out of the fixed term of my tenancy agreement. - not sure how that's relevant, as teh LL had to do extra admin etc to sign on the new tenant, so in return would like to know he has a committment to 6 months more than he originally had. The original fixed term being over is irrelevant as to reasonably benefit from that, you (jointly as tenants) shouldn't have put the LL through the extra change.

nearlynomadic wrote: »

..
- I am due to move into my new property in 7 days, and the new tenants to move in on the same day, and yet he still has not provided a reference. Understandably, the new LA is chasing me for this. - you are 'due to move in 7 days' and the new LA is chasing because you presumably made promises you shouldn't ahve. The existing LL is under no obligation to provide a reference or release you from your tenancy, so if you want to move, be prepared to pay rent for both.
- I've offered the new LA a reference from my previous LL, but they're not sure if the referencing company will accept it.
- I cannot afford to lose this property as, not only will I lose my £330 holding deposit, but it took me a long time to find the new property as I have a dog. - you haven't found a viable new property because although they take the dog, they seem to want a reference that you cannot provide and timing that you cannot stick to. In addition, if I don't go, I suspect my flatmate will move out and I will be trapped back into another new 12 month AST - thus the cycle will continue. - Why would your flatmate move if nothing changes from the plan that both of you stay? That's a separate issue you need to sort out. No cycle of ASTs.. you just need to not agree fixed terms that you cannot commit to. If the current flatmate wants to move and the proposal is a new 12 month fixed term, you don't have to agree to this.. alternative is keep negotiating or continue as is with the flatmate still liable.
- there's no deposit ("I couldn't be bothered to protect it"), simply paid first and last month's rent upfront. No inventory either, and no inspections (not even between tenants). - irrelevant, and a business decision by the LL.. given the increased regulation on deposits, it may be wiser for the LL to write off any damage and not risk falling foul of the regs.

Any thoughts on how to sort this out?

If I lose the next property due to LL's failure to provide a reference, it's just going to happen again and I'll be trapped here. - the LL hasn't failed to do anything, you're jsut expecting things that they don't have to do. There's no trapping, simply pay rent for the rest of the 12 months and leave before the fixed term. I'm tempted to stop paying rent, get evicted, move back to the parental home briefly and then use my parents as a LL reference. - welcome to an eviction, CCJ, court costs, eviction costs.. I understand this will cause issues for my flatmate too, but he's not exactly the model flatmate. Certainly if he loses me the £330 holding deposit then I'll deduct that from next month's rent. - WHY?! The LL has done nothing wrong, so you cannot legitimately punish him for you taking a punt on things lining up. Alternative / supplementary option is to tell him about the dog in the no pets flat (left behind by a previous tenant... long story but ultimately not my doing that the dog is here) which I'll be taking with me if he gives me a reference. I literally don't know what else to do

Do not deduct your lost fees from rent, the fee / holding deposit was your mistake for betting you were in a position to move when you weren't.

IF you want to get evicted, fine but beware you'd be breaching an agreement and you would be liable for more than just rent:
* lost rent until LL finds a replacement tenant who moves in
* court costs
* eviction & bailiff costs
* re advertising & re referencing costs

Comms69

nearlynomadic wrote: »

Situation is
- originally moved in Sept 2017 on a 12 month AST. Property is in England.
- in March my old flatmate moved out and I was told I had to sign a new 12 month AST - You didn't.
- the agreement, and indeed it has happened twice before, is that if you wish to move out prior to the end of the fixed term, you simply have to find a new tenant to replace you and that was fine. With 20/20 hindsight, I realise they didn't need references as one did a midnight flit and the other emigrated. - and you kept signing JOINT liability agreements...
- I told the LL I was moving out on 14/8, and that a search for new tenants would shortly commence (my flatmate who will be staying wanted to do the search, understandably). On or before 30/8, new tenants had been found, the landlord had been told and we had asked him to sort out paperwork. Unfortunately, in the subsequent 3.5 weeks, the LL has completely failed to respond to any of the chasing emails sent, and the phone just rings out. - That's perfectly normal. The LL doesn't HAVE to do anything
- I spoke to some builders last week who thought he might be on a fortnight's holiday (no out of office email, no warning, no answerphone message, no nothing). They said he would be back today, but the phone still just rings out. - You have an address, write to him
- I am due to move into my new property in 7 days, and the new tenants to move in on the same day, and yet he still has not provided a reference. Understandably, the new LA is chasing me for this. - All irrelevant. He doesn't have to let you leave the agreement or provide a reference
- I've offered the new LA a reference from my previous LL, but they're not sure if the referencing company will accept it. - It's nothing to do with a referencing company, it's whatever your new landlord will accept
- I cannot afford to lose this property as, not only will I lose my £330 holding deposit, but it took me a long time to find the new property as I have a dog. In addition, if I don't go, I suspect my flatmate will move out and I will be trapped back into another new 12 month AST - thus the cycle will continue. - you are already trapped in a AST.
- there's no deposit ("I couldn't be bothered to protect it"), simply paid first and last month's rent upfront. No inventory either, and no inspections (not even between tenants). - and?

Any thoughts on how to sort this out? - legally, it's by goodwill.

If I lose the next property due to LL's failure to provide a reference, it's just going to happen again and I'll be trapped here. I'm tempted to stop paying rent, get evicted, move back to the parental home briefly and then use my parents as a LL reference. - that is the stupidest thing you could do. I understand this will cause issues for my flatmate too, but he's not exactly the model flatmate. - You don't understand tenancy law or joint liability in the slightest Certainly if he loses me the £330 holding deposit then I'll deduct that from next month's rent. - you don't have the right to do that Alternative / supplementary option is to tell him about the dog in the no pets flat (left behind by a previous tenant... long story but ultimately not my doing that the dog is here) - still your responsibility; JOINT liability which I'll be taking with me if he gives me a reference. I literally don't know what else to do

Try finding out more about how contracts work. A the minute you've agreed a new contract but not agreed to end your old. You will be liable for 100% of the new rent and 100% (not 50%) of the old rent....

Comms69

nearlynomadic wrote: »

It's not written into the tenancy agreement - but then, all sorts of daft things are written into the tenancy agreement. It was a verbal agreement, with the evidence of two previous joint tenants leaving in this way before (one before my time) meaning that I had no reason to doubt it.



If he pursues me through the courts, surely the matter of loss mitigation would come up - that is, there's a duty to minimise the losses. - rent is a DEBT not a loss.... In this case, I spoke to him saying that I was going to be moving out, I have provided replacement tenants, and he has chosen to do nothing about it. Surely, given that he raised no objections to me moving out, he has a duty to minimise his losses in the form of taking the tenants (which meet the criteria he set out) so that they will pay the rent instead?

https://uk.practicallaw.thomsonreuters.com/5-107-6850?transitionType=Default&contextData=(sc.Default)&firstPage=true&comp=pluk&bhcp=1

I'll keep the rent money separate so I can pay up if he ever bothered to take me to court, so I could pay it off to avoid a CCJ, but seeing as he has explicitly said he can't be bothered to protect a deposit, and has never inspected the property in >2 years, I have my doubts that he would be bothered.

The move is a long distance one, for work reasons, so it would also affect my employment. If you have any other bright ideas of getting the landlord to release me from an agreement when I have been most reasonable, please do enlighten me. At the moment, all I can see is me being trapped into a chain of overlapping 12 months ASTs when other tenants move in and out - so this would be a recurring issue. I'll note that, had my old flatmate not emigrated, I would now be out of the fixed term of my tenancy agreement.

Or had you not signed a new agreement...