Consumer rights on used cars?

murtle1981

Hi all.
Passed my test in May and bought a car from a used car dealer the day after. Id saved 700 quid up while having my lessons as I really cant afford a new car but driving an old one really doesn't bother me.
Bought myself a lovely VW Polo, 03 plate, 76k on the clock which, for a 15 year old car isnt bad at all.
Got it home, everything fine. Car was immaculate and never missed a beat. However 3 weeks later a heard a thump from underneath then a light appeared on dash. Noticed a leak from somewhere underneath too.
So, with me having been offered no warranty and the car garage being a 2 hour drive away, I took it to the local mechanic. All the fluid out of the gear box had gone and i was lucky the gear box hadnt been smashed to bits. Mechanic said it had been festering for a while, probably since before I bought the car but dealer said it had a thorough inspection by his mechanic before they put it up for sale. Never got this in writing though. Anyway, Got it fixed and not a problem.

Fast forward to about 4 weeks ago. Noticed car was leaking oil. Then nasty burning smell from engine. Took it up to mechanic with possible headgasket problems. None found. Told to keep an eye on it.
Took it for MOT 2 weeks ago, failed on emissions, needed a new cat converter as the old one was severly corroded- been like that a while to be in the state it was. Then it started chucking loads of blue smoke out the exhaust. Piston rings were knackered. New engine needed.
Sold car for spares and repairs. Got 300 quid for it.
So now im dubious about buying another old car so been on some car forums. Got a wealth of advice from some really knowledgeable people. But thought is see where i stood when it comes to consumer rights incase i unknowingly get another nail of a car with no warranty.
Rang CAB and they said the following;
Under the consumer rughts act 2015, you as a consumer have the right to take a car back even a used one, if the car im question has been misrepresented at point of sale ie, faults have been present since the day of purchase or before, even underlying faults. You are also within your rights to ask for a refund, have it repaired or in some cases replaced. Its not up to the consumer to prove that the issues were present at the time of purchase, its up to the dealer to prove that they werent.
Woman at CAB said this applies to any car, no matter the age. As im still a consumer and the dealer is still a trader.
Is this right?
Been arguing with a guy on a forum and he says its a load of crap and that Im deluded!

macman

His mechanic may well have given it a 'thorough inspection': and found it to be a complete wreck. Unless the dealer gave you some guarantee of it's condition, and you can prove it, then you have no comeback. Your next mistake was not reporting the faults to the dealer but getting it fixed elsewhere. Also, you bought it with only about 6m left on the MOT.
Given that the dealer cannot have paid more than £3-400 for it, you are expecting far too much for a £700 car: if you got 6m use out of it for £400 then you've done well.
You do have far more consumer protection when buying from a dealer, but at the banger end of the market you will do far better to buy privately. Buying through the trade, your rights are the same under CRA 2015 whether it is a new car or has had 10 owners.

murtle1981

Yeah i agree about getting my moneys worth when you put it like that regarding MOT etc. Its my fault for buying a car with only 5 month test on it but it was advertised as having 8.
I didnt report the first issue to the dealer because i didnt think i stood a chance with having no warranty. He didnt even give me the usual 30 days. Been told hes ceased trading now, wonder why?!
Buying a used car is always a gamble but unfortunately ive got to as I need a car but have limited money. However i do know that you can pick some hidden gems up. Other half paid £310 for a Pug 206 about 6 years ago. Tatty old thing but never once let him down mechanically. Only let it go because we needed something bigger.
Im torn between the dealer v private thing too.
Some people say dealer as you have more rights, others say private as sellers are more genuine and don't want trouble at their door.
Also should I avoid part ex cars? Are they always bad?

macman

Yes, you do have more rights, but, in your case, you didn't take the right steps to secure them. And, once they cease trading, you have no comeback at all.
Bear in mind that a dealer needs to make at least £4-500 on a trade to make it remotely worth his while-so what was that car really worth as a trade in?

murtle1981

You've really opened my eyes now-thank you!
Glad you've put it into perspective for me. All these cars ive seen recently then that are up for 495 and been taken in as part ex are most likely nails with a multitude of hidden problems and are practically worthless.
However i have known friends who have bought cheap part ex cars and theyve served them well.
So...ill check MOT history (look out for cars with recurrent issues every year and lots of advisories and avoid those), make sure its got plenty of SH, and a decent bit of test left on. Whats the minimum you'd advise?
Also the cars i can afford are like 14/15 years old. Maximum mileage to look for?? Or should i not be too fussy about mileage and concentrate on cindtion, service history and MOT history??

agrinnall

I would suggest that buying a banger 2 hours drive away is asking for trouble. It's pretty likely that something will go wrong with a car costing a few hundred quid, and if you want the dealer who sells it to you to put it right it's a lot easier if they are 5 minutes away.

System

murtle1981 wrote: »

Bought myself a lovely VW Polo, 03 plate, 76k on the clock which, for a 15 year old car isnt bad at all.

Yes, yes it is bad. It is absolutely terrible. It means that car has only done around 5000 miles a year so has either done nothing but short journeys around town or spent lots of time stood or both. Neither are good for a car. Long time stood means things start to seize up, oil seals start to dry up, bearings lose the protective film of oil on them. Short journeys and town driving rapidly wear out a car. As you're finding out things like the exhaust rust faster because it never gets hot enough to evaporate the moisture in it, the engine suffers premature wear because the oil gets contaminated with petrol due to the car running pretty much mostly on cold start and the oil doesn't get hot enough to burn off the moisture in it so emulsifies and stops lubricating as well and because it hasn't gone far people don't feel the need to service it.

Low mileage cars should be avoided like the plague.

If you're going to buy a cheap older car you want to be looking at ones with at least 100,000-130,000 miles on that've been used and done regular long journeys, not 15 year old ones with 70k on which have spent most of their life doing the school run.

Svein_Forkbeard

Cars in this price range should be bought from friends or relatives that you know have been running ok.

Carrot007

murtle1981 wrote: »

76k on the clock which, for a 15 year old car isnt bad at all.

5k a year makes it sound like it's not been used enough and would probably be in bad consition and would have had be running away.


Min 7.5K/year for petrol and 12K/year for diesel. Why is this country obsessed with low milage which is not a good sign?

Carrot007

murtle1981 wrote: »

Yeah i agree about getting my moneys worth when you put it like that regarding MOT etc. Its my fault for buying a car with only 5 month test on it but it was advertised as having 8.

Yes, never buy a car is the dealer is not going to MOT it for you. Not that it could not be faked and that having a MOT means a car is in good condition.

Carrot007

murtle1981 wrote: »

Also the cars i can afford are like 14/15 years old. Maximum mileage to look for?? Or should i not be too fussy about mileage and concentrate on cindtion, service history and MOT history??

More important is minimum mileage! (see my other post) Unless there is evidence of it having a good life, which there won;t be at this level. also the service stamps mean nothing. Only proper reciepts mean anything.


As for Max 12K/year petrol 20k/year diesel.



Also buy from a person if possible. I bought a car for £100 privately that ran for years and the 2 reasons I got rid of it were little niggles (spilled a tin of paint in it and the drivers window stopped working) but were enough for a car of it's age that fixing them was potinless!


There are two cars in the household here currently. Mine is a 59 with 62K on it (and yes was probably a little under my recomendation at purchase, and if I were paying I would not have chosen it!). It's OK, not great.


The other is a 09 Petrol and has 142K on it. Yes over my recomendation by have had it since it was 2 and done most of the miles and have looked after it (never got the book stamped, have receipts though including 2 belt changes).


The 09 is probably worth pretty much nothing because of the milage. But I know it is the better car.