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Cabot and Marlin

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Hi all
Hoping for some advice

CC debt with HSBC approx £6500, originally defaulted in 2012, they sold the debt to Marlin.
Marlin chased me and in 2014 they made an error and sent out a letter offering settlement for £1500 ( they meant discount of £1500). I instantly paid this and emailed to accept their offer.
They of course came back and said it was an error. i ignored and have done ever since
The debt is now owned by cabot, i have never acknowledged them

Will they continue to chase and what point does it become statue barred?

I was given an offer to pay and did so, so i feel they are out of order chasing me, only issue is i cannot find the emails etc now, as outlook appears to have deleted all old email. I am trying to recover atm.
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  • sazzy32
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    Correction first defaulted in March 2010, offer for full and final that they got wrong was December 2014. So i paid the amount asked for in 2014, although they came back to me and said it was an error. I have not paid /or discussed since
  • sourcrates
    sourcrates Posts: 29,227 Ambassador
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    Approx two more years till it could be statute barred then.


    Look out for pre action letters.
    I’m a Forum Ambassador and I support the Forum Team on the Debt free wannabe, Credit file and ratings, and Bankruptcy and living with it boards. If you need any help on these boards, do let me know. Please note that Ambassadors are not moderators. Any posts you spot in breach of the Forum Rules should be reported via the report button, or by emailing forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. All views are my own and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.For free non-judgemental debt advice, contact either Stepchange, National Debtline, or CitizensAdviceBureaux.Link to SOA Calculator- https://www.stoozing.com/soa.php The "provit letter" is here-https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2607247/letter-when-you-know-nothing-about-about-the-debt-aka-prove-it-letter
  • National_Debtline
    National_Debtline Posts: 7,998 Organisation Representative
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    edited 13 September 2018 at 10:44AM
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    Hi Sazzy32,


    Under the limitations act a debt becomes statute barred if there has been a 6 year period of time since the debt fell due with no written acknowledgement, payments or county court action started. The 6 year clock starts from the last payment made, when the last payment was due and missed or the last written acknowledgement, which ever is the later.


    So, if you made a payment in 2014 that would be the start of the 6 year clock and sourcrates is right, this would potentially become statute barred in 2020, if no court action is started before then.


    I appreciate that you made the settlement payment in good faith, however, if they say that the settlement was not agreed to correctly (i.e. it was an error), and you have no documents to prove the offer they made or the terms they proposed surrounding this (marking your credit file as £0 balance and partially settled etc) then it could just be deemed as a payment to the debt. You can raise a complaint about this now (but that would very likely reset the limitation period), or you could wait and see if they start court action and then raise a dispute. Please just be aware that if you do wait, the debt may continue to increase through interest, charges and court fees and any dispute would be subjective and could ultimately be dealt with by the ombudsman/ court.


    Laura
    @natdebtline
    We work as money advisers for National Debtline and have specific permission from MSE to post to try to help those in debt. Read more information on National Debtline in MSE's Debt Problems: What to do and where to get help guide. If you find you're struggling with debt and need further help try our online advice tool My Money Steps
  • sazzy32
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    thanks all.

    i am looking for the emails now as the letter they sent stated full and final settlement. I paid what was asked ( doesn't matter if i guessed it was an error)
    they only told me after payment that it was an error.

    What would a pre action letter look? i get regular ( once a quarter), we need to talk to you letters and had a statement this week, but nothing else.

    It was with marlin when i paid the offered full and final and they Cabot must have since bought it.
    I need to find the emails really as i will have proof then that i was offered and paid
  • Just_Di
    Just_Di Posts: 385 Forumite
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    edited 13 September 2018 at 12:12PM
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    sazzy32 wrote: »
    It was with marlin when i paid the offered full and final and they Cabot must have since bought it.

    I would need to know more facts but the issue of assignment may be important.

    A debt must be assigned lawfully before the new debt owner (the assignee) can collect it. Cabot would have to prove they have title to the debt.

    The dates of what happened are key to this issue, as are the exact names of the entities involved. If you search the FCA Register you'll see why I'm saying that, because Marlin's authorisation lapsed.

    You say that Marlin sold it to Cabot but I think that is unlikely (they are part of the same Group). This isn't strictly relevant at this stage but if they were to issue a claim then it may become central to your Defence argument..

    At the moment you're hearing from Cabot, if they decide to 'go legal' they would instruct solicitors to send you a Letter Before Claim giving you 30 days to respond during which you can ask to see various documents. If that happens then I would suggest you ask to see the Deed of Assignment (in fact the whole chain of assignment).

    Cabot typically instruct Mortimer Clarke (they own them) or Restons or Shoosmiths so keep your eye open for any letters received from any of those solicitors, and post on your thread if you do.

    Di
  • Just_Di
    Just_Di Posts: 385 Forumite
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    edited 13 September 2018 at 12:28PM
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    sazzy32 wrote: »
    Marlin chased me and in 2014 they made an error and sent out a letter offering settlement for £1500 ( they meant discount of £1500). I instantly paid this and emailed to accept their offer.
    They of course came back and said it was an error. i ignored and have done ever since
    The debt is now owned by cabot, i have never acknowledged them

    Will they continue to chase and what point does it become statue barred?

    I was given an offer to pay and did so.

    Firstly, was Marlin's offer to settle headed "Without Prejudice"?

    If it was then what followed may also be considered as privileged (cannot be disclosed in court) even if the rest of the email chain wasn't exchanged on a WP basis (I can't be sure without seeing the whole thing).

    If you can't find the emails etc then you could send a Subject Access Request to Cabot/Marlin to get the information which they have on their file.

    Secondly, if a payment settlement was agreed and paid you may have an argument for 'estoppel' if they issue a claim.

    I'm not able to post links on this forum, but if you head to Google or Wikipedia you will see that estoppel is a legal challenge to whether an agreement made can be unmade (that's a bit of a simplistic explanation but it's a start :)).

    I'm raising the second issue because it may have an impact on your Statute Barred status.

    At the moment it appears things are quiet (correct me if I'm wrong) so I wouldn't rock the boat at this stage. Don't even send the SAR unless things get noisy.

    Di
  • sazzy32
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    thank you

    So just sit on it for now and see if a solictor gets in touch?

    in the meantime i will try to find the lost emails

    thanks for your advice
  • Just_Di
    Just_Di Posts: 385 Forumite
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    edited 13 September 2018 at 3:04PM
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    sazzy32 wrote: »
    So just sit on it for now and see if a solictor gets in touch?

    Yes and No :)

    From what you say there's no urgent need to interact with Cabot at the moment. In fact since you've had no contact with either Marlin or them since 2014 then maybe now is not the time to start a conversation.

    If you make a complaint you will draw attention to your account and they may go on the defensive - or even the offensive (instruct solicitors to issue a claim).

    This is a time to do your homework to establish your legal position so you're ready if they were to pounce.

    You say this was a HSBC credit card. Did you have any other products with HSBC such as a loan or a current account? HBSC had/have a habit of amalgamating delinquent accounts before selling them on as a new 'account' number.

    This can cause them some difficulty if they combine a CCA Regulated account (such as a credit card or loan) with one which is Unregulated (such as an overdraft which wasn't renewed annually since 2012).

    If this was a credit card then you can send a s 77-79 CCA Request to Cabot to see if they can comply. If they can't comply within the statutory time-frame then the debt becomes unenforceable until or unless they do comply. I would wait for their next move before doing that, but keep this tactic up your sleeve :)

    If the debt really isn't going to be Statute Barred until December 2020 then you may be looking at ways to filibuster until it is.

    However you must do what feels right for you because I'm bound to see your situation through legal eyes whereas you may have personal reasons for doing things differently. Believe it or not my aim is to prevent a court claim while at the same time being mindful of getting prepared in case it happens.

    Di
  • sazzy32
    sazzy32 Posts: 37 Forumite
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    Hi So sadly have to come back to this thread.

    Cabot have stepped up and are constantly calling me. I have blocked the number now but clearly they aren't going away.

    last night i had a voicemail from Mortimer Clarke just saying who they were, so assume it is linked to this

    So what should i be doing now?

    I cannot find the letter from December 2014 or the email i responded with which is frustrating really
  • sazzy32
    sazzy32 Posts: 37 Forumite
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    this was just a credit card no combined accounts.

    Is now the time to send Cabot a CCA request?

    Could i also send them a SAR as if Marlin are part of the same group then i may be able to get the letter that way.

    TBh i would like to just agree a full and final and get it paid. Current balance is around £5k, does anyone know what they accept?
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