Run around from parking company

hales8181

My Mom has been issued with 2 separate parking notices from Civil Enforcement, on both occasions it was a case of 'double dipping' at KFC, and on both occasions she has gotten proof that she was elsewhere between the notices (she dropped her boyfriend off at KFC, went to play bingo, her membership card was scanned in and out during these times, and then picked him back up 3 hours later).

She tried calling the number and found there was only the option to pay and not appeal. This was back in January/February. Unfortunately, it's only now she has told me - She's disabled, I look after her money and she's not great at reading things and didn't realise that she had to write and appeal.

The fines were referred to a debt recovery agency, to which she appealed sending the proof of her whereabouts, they said they didn't receive it, she did the same again, same nonsense about not receiving it. On the 3rd occasion she sent it recorded, they then told her that they'd received it but it was too late and it had been referred back to Civil Enforcement. At this point she has told me as she now has been told that both fines are now £170 each and if she doesn't reply in 30 dayst hen she will be taken to court.

I've told her to start a POPLA appeal, but she hasn't been given a number to do so, she's contacted Civil enforcement again and they have said they can't give it as she didn't appeal properly. This all seems incredibly unfair, although appreciate that she should have appealed properly in the first place. I suspect someone may have told her not to.

Any idea if we still have the right to appeal?

Thanks in advance.

beamerguy

Please firstly edit your post and display in paragraphs
as many will not read a wall of text

Then carefully read the NEWBIES thread

The good news is you don't owe £170 per ticket.
These are FAKE add-ons by the !!!!!! debt collector
who you should have ignored in the first place.

So, this letter giving you 30 days ? .... does it say
Letter Before Action at the the top

Does the letter provide you with proof of their claim

hales8181

Thanks for the reply. I've already read through the NEWBIES thread, I'm still not sure when she stands as it was so long ago and she didn't do the proper appeal.

The initial PCNs have pictures of her car going in and out at the the times stated but of course no pictures of her leaving and coming back in between - convenient that! Both were maximum 1 hour parking, no return within 1 hour. Both times she just dropped off and then picked up 3 hours later.

The letter re court doesn't say letter before action - but just says In accordance with Pre Action Conduct and Protocol for debt claims, we wish to give you a final opportunity to settle your debt or agree a payment plan with us.
If we do not receive a reply within 30 days from the date of this letter we will be left wit no alternative but to issue proceedings in the County Court.

Quentin

Everyone is politely asked to read up on this in the newbies FAQ thread near the top of the forum before starting a new thread. You appear to have missed all the relevant advice there!

Right to appeal is long gone

Go there now to learn about the game you are now caught up in and how to deal with this

You cannot simply make a popla appeal way down the line like this!

If she has received proper lbccas (did they enclose forms to be returned?) then #2 in the FAQ covers how to deal with lbccas and court claims

waamo

The opportunity to appeal has long since gone. You need to start preparing for a court claim landing on your mothers mat. CEL launch a fair number of claims. See here for details. http://www.parkingappeals.info/companydata/Civil_Enforcement.html

The good news is a robust defence sees them off. Given your mum can show she wasn't there you can win this.

The bad news is that CEL seem to be actually progressing a few of these no hope cases all the way to court. Up until recently they tended to fold at the very last minute. Now they seem to enjoy embarrassing themselves in front of a judge. They may change tack again though as boy have they embarrassed themselves and it's got costly for them having to pay out expenses to the other side.

Just to get prepared search this forum for CEL defence. The Newbies thread at the top of this board also has examples and has links to robust responses to letters before claims. Post 2 is what you want.

nosferatu1001

You cannot appeal
Get that out of your head

You have to respond to the letter before action - which that leetter i - and if you have TWO, remind them that any aciton must be for both TOGEHTER< not individually, else you will ask for any subseuqnet claim to be sturck

You do not have to provide evidence to the,m, but to get your cards on the table, that is what I will do
State that the driver was not there for the length of time and was actually at X locaitomn. Proof atahced as reference Y
They have no possible claim, as this is a clear error in THEIR equipment. In fact as they hd no cause to issue a charge, they had no causeto access the RKs personal , private data, and as such have harmed the RK for which damages are payable

Should they be foolish and attempt a court claim now they have been fully informed of the failure in their own equipment, a failure entrely of their own making, you will issue a counterclaim for a sum of no less than £500 for each breahc of the DPA.

hales8181

I have already read the newbies thing - but this isn't a LBCCA. I'm not sure what to do, she's tried popla, but as she hadn't appealed properly it can't be heard there.

The letter says intended legal collections, 'Final reminder before legal action', it has no contact number on it and no forms. I'm guessing our best course of action is to wait for the a proper letter before action - but I'm starting to think reading the letter (my Mom has just sent a pic) that we may not get that .

beamerguy

hales8181 wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. I've already read through the NEWBIES thread, I'm still not sure when she stands as it was so long ago and she didn't do the proper appeal.

The initial PCNs have pictures of her car going in and out at the the times stated but of course no pictures of her leaving and coming back in between - convenient that! Both were maximum 1 hour parking, no return within 1 hour. Both times she just dropped off and then picked up 3 hours later.

The letter re court doesn't say letter before action - but just says In accordance with Pre Action Conduct and Protocol for debt claims, we wish to give you a final opportunity to settle your debt or agree a payment plan with us.
If we do not receive a reply within 30 days from the date of this letter we will be left wit no alternative but to issue proceedings in the County Court.

Well done for reading the Newbies thread

So, it is a LBA and you must reply to this

This is a typical double dip case. ANPR is well known
not to be accurate and confirmed by the CEO of the BPA
to which CEL are one of their members.

To start the ball rolling, in your reply, you dispute their
ANPR data and request pictures of her leaving the site.
Also request logs of the ANPR for the time periods.

They do not like providing log data especially as it's
known to be dodgy

Under the new protocol, you have every right to place
in doubt their claim and until they answer to your satisfaction
within the 30 days, (best to do it sooner, but not too soon)
there is little they can do.

CEL are well known for ignoring letters and you must
be ultra wary of them if they do ignore and issue a court
claim, then with the help of this forum we will beat them

CEL are famous for doing this and they are also famous
for discontinuing at the last moment because they know
their claim will fail

Understand how your enemy works ... read this

https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/search?q=cel

Quentin

MBA

hales8181 wrote: »

I have already read the newbies thing - but this isn't a LBCCA. I'm not sure what to do, she's tried popla, but as she hadn't appealed properly it can't be heard there.

The letter says intended legal collections, 'Final reminder before legal action', it has no contact number on it and no forms. I'm guessing our best course of action is to wait for the a proper letter before action - but I'm starting to think reading the letter (my Mom has just sent a pic) that we may not get that .

Nevertheless she should treat it as a lbcca

Follow the advice in #6 above on responding

See #2 in the newbies FAQ thread which covers this

beamerguy

hales8181 wrote: »

I have already read the newbies thing - but this isn't a LBCCA. I'm not sure what to do, she's tried popla, but as she hadn't appealed properly it can't be heard there.

The letter says intended legal collections, 'Final reminder before legal action', it has no contact number on it and no forms. I'm guessing our best course of action is to wait for the a proper letter before action - but I'm starting to think reading the letter (my Mom has just sent a pic) that we may not get that .

Consider this as a LBA even though CEL are not well known
for writing correct and proper letters
It's the 30 days that's the clue that this is an LBA

waamo

I would treat it as a LBCC. Set your stall out early as their case is wholly unwinable. Should they be foolish enough to go to court then you want to establish first a DPA breach and secondly a pattern of unreasonable behaviour.

This will get the judge on side from the off and show you have made every effort to avoid court. This goes down very well and influences the amount of costs you can claim.