Parking Eye Help Needed

BristolJack

Hi,
I have read through the Newbies sticky and looked through as many threads as possible but I am still a bit lost. I have now had an appeal by Parkingeye rejected, possibly as I I had not read your thread correctly and shot off the appeal to early with incorrect advice.

Parkingeye sent me through a parking charge notice for my car being in a car park behind a pub for for the grand total of 11 minutes as we stopped to calm kids down and see if they had food available immediately. As there was an England football game on we did not stay.

Underneath is what I put down on my original appeal. I would like some help in what to do next in my Popla appeal.

Wish I'd found your advice first but new to this and very confused.


You issued me with a parking ticket on 07/07/2018 but I believe it was unfairly issued. I decline your invitation to name the driver, which is not required of me as the keeper of the vehicle. I will not be paying your demand for payment for the following reasons:

Mitigating circumstances
There are mitigating circumstances to explain why the vehicle was parked where it was and the charge should be waived for this reason. The car was parked very briefly at the rear of the George and Dragon as my 3 and 5 year-old girls were getting hungry which was making them upset. The car was parked for a matter of minutes as my wife tried to calm the children and I went into the pub to see if they could serve food straight away. As the pub was getting busy ready for the England v Sweden game that was starting soon there could be a wait for food and there were too many people which would make my children uncomfortable. I went back to the car and explained this to my wife and we decided it would be too much of a hassle so we took the children elsewhere. As we had been in the car park for approximately 10 minutes and now had no intention of staying we left. I cannot see any way of justifying a charge to stop a car away from a main road for period of approximately 10 minutes to check on the well-being if young children.

The charge is disproportionate and not commercially justifiable
The amount you have charged is not based upon any commercially justifiable loss to your company or the landowner. I have spoken to the pub who have told me that the parking charge is £0.20 for 30 minutes and £1.00 per hour. Had we decided to stay we would have had no issue with payment but as we did not do so and left in the grace period of approximately 10 minutes, any payment should not be required.
Your parking notice has been sent to me for parking between 14:01 and 14:12 which is 11 minutes. The 11 minutes included the time in which the car had to be parked, children were checked to see if they were OK, children had water and had their seatbelts checked and the car was then moved again. The £100 charge you are asking for far exceeds the cost to the landowner of £0.20. I therefore feel the charge you have asked for is grossly excessive.

In addition this incident where the car was parked was on 07/07/2018. On your parking charge notice the date issued is 04/08/2018.
The Notice to Keeper failed to meet the obligations of Schedule 4 of the POFA Act 2012. 6.2 Where a contravention is detected remotely (such as by cameras), the landholder may request registered keeper data from the DVLA immediately and must write to the registered keeper within 14 days seeking details of the driver or payment of the parking charge.


If you choose to pursue me please be aware that I will not enter into any correspondence and this will be the only letter you will receive from me until you answer the specific points raised in my letter.

Redx

ok , some background first

so you used an appeal and refused to name the driver ? - GOOD

you did this as KEEPER after receiving a postal NTK and appealed within the first 28 days ? - GOOD


you pointed out that PE had failed POFA2012 by not sending out the NTK to arrive by day 15 following the incident ? - GOOD


you stated that the loss was low, what we know "as not a gpeol" - BAD

its bad because Parking Eye took Barry Beavis to 3 courts over 2 years and he lost every time, meaning that argument does not win as the Supreme Court ruled aagainst him and in favour of PE, so they would have laughed at that one

also , Mitigation rarely wins in any appeal, they do not care, they just want your money, as much as possible , thats it , it pays for their Bentleys

so the alleged rule breaking was staying 11 minutes before leaving the site, this is known as a GRACE PERIOD and clause 13 of the jan 2018 BPA CoP covers it (its typically thought to be about 10 minutes) - this time is also NOT parking time , its the total time on the site , from entry to exit. the actual "parking time" would have been less , perhaps 6 minutes out of the 11 minutes on the site


also , they sent the notice out too late, what we call a "golden ticket" , because it had to arrive by day 15 and not a month later , so the keeper has no liability
this means they failed POFA2012 and is a simple slam dunk win for a keeper because of their failure to abide by POFA2012


so I assume you have a POPLA code , which needs appealing within 28 days (up to 33 days actually)

so see post #3 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread and construct a popla appeal based on the usual arguments


POFA 2012 failure

NO LANDOWNER CONTRACT
POOR AND INADEQUATE SIGNAGE
GRACE PERIODS
any NTK errors
any BPA CoP errors

etc

I would also use the forum search box and find other 2018 popla appeals where grace periods are a factor , and adapt one of those, saves typing it all out from scratch

post the proposed draft appeal on here for critique

lastly, I dont see that you did anything wrong as regards appealing etc, as long as the driver was not divulged then getting the popla code was almost inevitable , but next time you will know to check here first

onlyfoolsandparking

Yes you sure did send off the appeal too early and surprise surprise it was rejected. You need to read the NEWBIES thread in much more depth and understand the game you are now involved in.


The appeal you sent whilst interesting to read is poor, its mixed with your nice day out and Laws??


These people are not interested in your reasons, you have to fight them with cold hard facts and rules.


Your last statement of not entering into any correspondence etc etc means absolutely nothing, your now in a game of Threatograms debt letters and maybe culminating in a Court claim but worry not 99% of these PPC,s are beaten in Court, get reading.

Redx

it wasnt too early, you can appeal a postal notice (NTK) any time you like as long as its within the 28 day appeal window

onlyfoolsandparking

Well ok not too early but definitely not well researched

Redx

agreed, so I have posted a comprehensive analysis of that appeal in post #2 and have been honing it as I glean more facts from post #1

the good news is that the OP has a "golden ticket" and pointed that out to PE so their popla appeal should be a slam dunk seeing as they did not name the driver

its unusual for PE to fail POFA2012 , so this OP should be checking for that missing POFA paragraph, proving that PE know they failed POFA and were phishing

therefore POFA2012 becomes the number one point in their POPLA appeal, but bolt on grace periods etc for good measure , which probably means that PE will tell POPLA that they are not contesting the appeal (to save their popla fee)

BristolJack

Thanks for the updates. Unfortunately when I googled Parking Notice appeals there were all kinds of different templates and advice was unclear. Yes if I'd gone straight to the Newbies sticky it might have been easier. Now I have read through the MSE Newbie thread I know I didn't need to put the circumstances in. I shall now just appeal to POPLA based on grace period and Notice to Keeper dates. In relation to parking charge signs I did not see any as we didn't hang around but I have googled and found one on the facebook page of The Fat Friar Batheaston. It is somewhere in the car park. I don't know where it is and I have no intention of going back as it is not somewhere near to me. I will look online to see if anyone has any.

onlyfoolsandparking

Redx wrote: »

agreed, so I have posted a comprehensive analysis of that appeal in post #2 and have been honing it as I glean more facts from post #1

the good news is that the OP has a "golden ticket" and pointed that out to PE so their popla appeal should be a slam dunk seeing as they did not name the driver

its unusual for PE to fail POFA2012 , so this OP should be checking for that missing POFA paragraph, proving that PE know they failed POFA and were phishing

therefore POFA2012 becomes the number one point in their POPLA appeal, but bolt on grace periods etc for good measure , which probably means that PE will tell POPLA that they are not contesting the appeal (to save their popla fee)

As i have said previously Redx and will probably keep saying i don't know as much about all this as i would like but I'm learning more every day:T

Redx

just do a generic popla appeal with those 2 issues as points 1 and 2

also add the landowner and signage points as well, plus any others just to make it longer (if you dont , popla wont consider them) (those 2 points should ALWAYS be included in any POPLA appeal)

the NTK issue under POFA2012 (GOLDEN TICKET) should mean the assessor sees that and allows the appeal (or PE withdraw having seen your popla appeal)

once POPLA rule in your favour, its over with, you only have to win on a single point , PE have to overcome each and every point you make , hence the more the merrier

you have learned some valuable lessons, but I dont see that you did anything wrong as such , the appeal was longer than was required but your legal points were correct, so good on you for understanding some of these issues before you even came here

all I am doing is laying out the basics so you and anyone else reading it can see the truth for what it is , good initial research by you and a failure of the law by PE , meaning a win for you

Fruitcake

Please also take the time to complain to your MP, and the MP where the pub is located if different, about this unregulated scam.

MPs called this a scam in open parliament, and it's covered in post 1 of the NEWBIES, so please help us to help more people like you once you have got your PoPLA appeal out the way. Post your draft here for checking before you submit it.

Tell everyone you know where to come if they get a PCN as well.

Coupon-mad

Please be careful with your POPLA wording. You have almost blown it already.

In fact, I wonder if you have...did you choose 'driver' in the drop-down menu when you appealed online? Eeeeeeeeekkkk!!! Please say no, please say you didn't.