Help please - have i made a mistake?

Coupon-mad

I disagree. Robert Goodwill's letter tells Councils they cannot operate their car parks as if they were private land/under contract. It doesn't make clear which Council car parks are 'relevant land' or not (and how do POPLA know that this site has never had an off-street Parking Places Order?).

And this is POPLA stage not court, so a lower level of decision-making is involved and evidence is needed for each point, including those made by PPCs.

PP cannot be heard to say that any car park ''has never been subject to statutory control'' with no evidence of same, when it is Council land according to the witness statement/contract (I hope)?

All you have to do is put doubt in the POPLA Assessor's mind and point out the lack of evidence. Remind POPLA they are an evidence-based service and all the evidence points to it being under statutory control due to the contract/witness statement from the Council and their clear intention to try to control the parking - which Councils can't do under contract law.

Standupforyourself

so if there IS an off street parking order in place?

Coupon-mad

I very much doubt there is, that's not what I was saying at all!

Standupforyourself

sorry Coupon, what were you saying? I've been thrown!

Coupon-mad

I can't repeat myself again and again...what is unclear about post #142?

Standupforyourself

sorry, just trying to ascertain if i need to find this information out or not

Coupon-mad

I am telling you that I would be 99.9% sure there is no Parking Places Order (it is also pointless looking because you cannot add evidence at 'comments' stage).

That is not what I am saying. Who cares if there was/wasn't one. It would be different if this was a court defence, but I did spell out the difference and what to say to POPLA.

System

There are 3 possibilities

1. There was a PPO in place so the Goodwill advice stands. It cannot be "relevant land"
2. PPS pay the Non-domestic rates and so are the operators as they have the lease.
3. No PPO / No rates being paid and the vague "we are operating under contract". This appears to be Coupon's view on the matter that it is not relevant land. But it is a grey area (though I understand what Coupon is saying about POPLA.

All I am saying is that you should concentrate on winning points and not weak ones where there is a grey area. The reason is the judges are hard on Pay and Display defaulters and treat them almost like shoplifters. You'd better win at POPLA.

Standupforyourself

Pay and Display defaulter! The alleged infringement refers to a 31 min total overstay over a period of nearly 4 hours in which tickets WERE purchased. And this assumes the time keeping of the ANPR machines is correct.

Anyway, I will draft a response to run by you guys!

System

Pay and Display defaulter! The alleged infringement refers to a 31 min total overstay over a period of nearly 4 hours in which tickets WERE purchased

The driver defaults 1 second over - 31 minutes is clearly a default by a wide margin. If you want to see what happens when faced with a judge on a P&D argument read this one

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/58420872#39

Just don't use weak arguments as you need to win at POPLA.