Side extension no building regulation completion certificate - Will resell be a problem?

tristanjourney

Hoploz wrote: »

Speak to the seller. Ask the question - there was an application, but doesn't seem to be a completion certificate ... Why?

It could be something very simple that would put your mind at rest. They might have changed their plans, not received the certificate they needed from electrician then forgot about it ... (this is where I am at the moment, 2 months after the job finished I've just chased them up. It most people would've forgotten all about it!)

Just have a conversation! As already said, if they applied then it's unlikely they have deliberately set out to do things wrong, or done a bodge DIY job

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely let my solicitor ask the reason of not having the completion certificate.

Hoploz

If you ask your solicitor, they will write a letter to the other solicitor, they will write a letter to the seller, they will reply to their solicitor, they will write to yours, they will write to you ... All in single sentence answers.

Get the estate agent to phone the seller. Or better still, ask to meet the seller at the house for another viewing, and speak to them face to face. You'll learn a lot more. And if they have something to hide it will be clear!

fezster

Doozergirl wrote: »

Any decent solicitor will know that there is no time limit on enforcement!

Enforcement against who? The builder / contractor? The original homeowner? The current owner, 24 years after building work was finished?

After 12 months, Building Control would need a court order to enforce. I am talking about quite serious structural defect for it to be worth it, but the threat is not entirely removed.

On what legal basis would this court order be made? And again, on whom? The link I provided says


the local authority may serve an enforcement notice on the building owner requiring alteration or removal of work which contravenes the regulations (section 36 of the 1984 Act).

<snip>

A section 36 enforcement notice cannot be served on you after the expiration of 12 months from the date of completion of the building work.


More importantly, please provide an example of action having been taken under the building regulations, in the OPs context.

I understand your desire to be thorough, but some context needs to be taken into consideration when providing an opinion. The extension hasnt fallen down after 24 years. Its unlikely (read impossible) to be so defective as to warrant the kind of legal action you are alluding to.

I stand by my assertion that any decent solicitor would explain this to her client whilst still asking them to purchase an indemnity policy in order to satisfy their legal obligation to the mortgage provider.

It's exactly why I am repeating myself by saying that where you need to be satisfied that the building is structurally sound. If you are, then Building Control will be.

I agree with this point, by the way, and said so in my original post.

I also agree with the point you made about listed buildings - that would change this whole scenario considerably.

Doozergirl

fezster wrote: »

Enforcement against who? The builder / contractor? The original homeowner? The current owner, 24 years after building work was finished?



On what legal basis would this court order be made? And again, on whom? The link I provided says


the local authority may serve an enforcement notice on the building owner requiring alteration or removal of work which contravenes the regulations (section 36 of the 1984 Act).

<snip>

A section 36 enforcement notice cannot be served on you after the expiration of 12 months from the date of completion of the building work.


More importantly, please provide an example of action having been taken under the building regulations, in the OPs context.

I understand your desire to be thorough, but some context needs to be taken into consideration when providing an opinion. The extension hasnt fallen down after 24 years. Its unlikely (read impossible) to be so defective as to warrant the kind of legal action you are alluding to.

I stand by my assertion that any decent solicitor would explain this to her client whilst still asking them to purchase an indemnity policy in order to satisfy their legal obligation to the mortgage provider.



I agree with this point, by the way, and said so in my original post.

I also agree with the point you made about listed buildings - that would change this whole scenario considerably.

You're right. I've already been thorough.

Your link refers to Section 36 of the Building Act. There are more sections than number 36. It would be absurd if Building Control had zero power to take enforcement action on something they were unaware of, but they do need an injunction as they can't use the simple powers under Section 36.

I have already said several times that the likelihood of enforcement is close to zero. The 12 month time limit does bear influence as it makes it expensive to follow up, so therefore anyhing that might be highlighted would actually come up in survey as a straight mortgage refusal and put the burden straight back on the homeowner to either rectify the problems or take a hit on the price to a cash purchaser.

I've said all along that the risk to the OP is virtually nothing and if your read into what I'm saying, I am pretty muchbsaying that it doesn't matter who contacts building control. If one buyer pulls out over paperwork then there will be another to take their place. No one can prove whether or not building control were contacted to invalidate the policy at any time. It may already have been done and the OP doesn't know. The OP can even buy a policy at higher price that covers future owners, putting it straight on the table that BC aren't to be contacted.

Hoploz actually describes the likely scenario in this case - a missing electrical certificate or suchlike that the homeowner forgot to chase up after a couple of times.

WillowCat

Hoploz wrote: »

It could be something very simple that would put your mind at rest. They might have changed their plans, not received the certificate they needed from electrician then forgot about it ... (this is where I am at the moment, 2 months after the job finished I've just chased them up. It most people would've forgotten all about it!)

Me too, though it's 9 years now. I had all the inspections, the last thing was the electrical work. Got that from the electrician, then never actually bothered getting building inspector back for the completion certificate. Oh well, I'm not planning on selling anyway!

tristanjourney

Doozergirl wrote: »

I've said all along that the risk to the OP is virtually nothing and if your read into what I'm saying, I am pretty muchbsaying that it doesn't matter who contacts building control. If one buyer pulls out over paperwork then there will be another to take their place. No one can prove whether or not building control were contacted to invalidate the policy at any time. It may already have been done and the OP doesn't know. The OP can even buy a policy at higher price that covers future owners, putting it straight on the table that BC aren't to be contacted.

In theory, the indemnity insurance is invalidated if someone contacted building control. But, in practice, no one can prove it is invalidated until people try to claim the indemnity insurance. Is it what you are trying to say?

If it is, it doesn't feel right.

tristanjourney

A couple of further questions I have:

1) If I go for indemnity insurance, does it mean I will not be able to do works that involve building control in the future as that will invalidate the insurance? Potentially this will deter some buyers when I sell due to this limitation?

2) To confirm that the extension is in good quality, what survey should I have? I already have a Building Survey done, but I am not certain if this is enough. I am still waiting for the surveyor's further comment about the quality of the extension and I haven't found any defects mentioned in the report.

tristanjourney

Anyone could help with my further questions above?

I also received a comment regarding the extension form the surveyor who did the building survey for me:

Comments about the quality of extension works:
Overall the extension was in a condition to be expected for the age and type etc. I would however highlight that any issues with regards to the completion certificate that you are having now with regards to the purchase are also issues that are likely to come up again in the future when you come to sell the property.

Comment about the necessity of structural engineer survey:
There was no evidence at the time of survey to suggest a structural engineer was required. However if there is no completion certificate then it may be a structural engineer could look at the extension in more detail with regards to this.

Richard_Webster

It's already been suggested you go and ask the seller why there is no completion certificate.

Sometimes the building inspector comes round and says that the builder needs to do this and that before he can sign it off - sometimes it's quite minor things like installing an extractor fan.

So if you ask the seller why there is no certificate he is either going to avoid giving you a straight answer because he knows there is some issue that would require expensive work that he doesn't want to do or he will admit quite openly what was needed. If he can produce correspondence from the Council stating these points and you consider they won't cost much then you may be prepared to accept an indemnity policy (to keep the lender happy). I the future if you have a problem you simply do the work.

This is the sort of case where direct contact is probably better than through solicitors although it may be best if the answers are helpful to then get them confirmed in writing through them. If not helpful and the seller is obviously hiding something then walk away or at least threaten to do so.

In general terms Doozergirl has written a lot of common sense and I agree with her posts.

Hoploz

The past won't affect any future work you have done. You'll only have the new work inspected - they don't go round looking for other things in the house. The indemnity would be for work done before x date. You just go ahead as normal for future plans and get your own completion certificate for that job.