Paypal and small claims court

unholyangel

Sam1224 wrote: »

Now guys, what happens if PayPal registered address in London does not even exist? Has anyone been there recently!

Thanks

If only there was some way to check from the comfort of your own home

It looks like the address of Taylor Wessing - a law firm. Which means paypal is unlikely to have any assets there to seize.

waamo

How much is the debt for? If it is over £1000 then it can be escalated to the High Court. High Court Enforcement Officers can go to any property the company has (if they indeed have a genuine physical presence).

You are now learning that enforcing a judgement can be difficult.

steampowered

5 New Street Square is indeed Taylor Wessing's offices - I've been there a few times, they are a large national law firm.

It looks like Taylor Wessing do the the company secretary work for Paypal (Europe) Ltd, hence why their office is the registered address. I doubt that Paypal has assets at that address.

However, note that the CCJ is issued against the Defendant - not against an address. HCEOs are able to enforce at any address where they believe Paypal (Europe) Ltd has assets, the HCEOs don't have to go to 5 New Street Square.

So your next job is to see if you can find out where Paypal (Europe) Ltd might have assets.

Another approach - possibly more effective in this case - would be to serve a statutory demand against Paypal (Europe) Ltd. Followed by making an application to wind up the company if they don't pay - that will get their attention. A statutory demand is free, but the court cost of applying for a winding up petition is large (something like £1,600 at the moment).

steampowered

I just checked Paypal (Europe) Ltd's accounts (https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/04056498/filing-history).

I can't see any physical assets on that company's balance sheet, so I doubt you can use HCEOs or bailiffs to enforce this CCJ.

That company does have EUR 82 million of cash on its balance sheet though, so if you do get a CCJ and threaten to wind it up, that is a pretty serious threat.

You have almost certainly sued the wrong company here. The PayPal user agreement is with a company called PayPal (Europe) S.à.r.l. et Cie, S.C.A., and says you must send any notices to PayPal’s head office at PayPal (Europe) S.à r.l. et Cie, S.C.A. Attention: Legal Department, 22-24 Boulevard Royal L-2449, Luxembourg.

Up to you whether you want to restart the process suing the correct company or whether you just want to proceed with the CCJ you've got.

Though once you have a CCJ in your hand, the background doesn't matter so much - until such time as PayPal applies to have the CCJ set aside and the court grants a set aside, a CCJ can be enforced as it is.

Sam1224

Many thanks guys for your responses.

The judgement is for more than £600 so I am entitle of asking a High Court Enforcement Officer to collect the money from PayPal, if PayPal has no assets at the London address and since the CCJ is issued to the defendant not the address then I can request the Enforcement Officer to collect the money from PayPal office at the Richmond address instead

PayPal (Europe) Ltd
WHITTAKER HOUSE
WHITTAKER AVENUE
RICHMOND
SURREY
TW9 1EH

I don’t live near by so I am not able to go there in person to check at neither the London or Richmond offices, so please guys advise me on the Richmond address has PayPal got assets there?

Thanks

waamo

I would go with the statutory demand. I doubt if PayPal has any actual physical assets.

Sam1224

waamo wrote: »

I would go with the statutory demand. I doubt if PayPal has any actual physical assets.

Many thanks Waamo for your response.

I will for sure serve them a statutory demand.

I didn’t know what it meant but I done some research and found this:

“The statutory demand is a formal written demand for payment of a debt within 21 days. If the debtor does not pay within the 21 days and either fails to apply to have it set aside (individual), or fails to apply to restrain the creditor from presenting a petition (company), the creditor can use it as grounds to present a petition to the court for a bankruptcy order or winding up order.
Non-payment of a statutory demand may be deemed evidence of the debtor's inability to pay their debts. If the sum demanded (or several sums if more than one demand) exceeds the money sum (£750 for companies: section 123(1)(a), Insolvency Act 1986) or equals or exceeds bankruptcy level (£5,000 for individuals: section 267(4), Insolvency Act 1986), the creditor is in a position to present a petition for a winding up order or a bankruptcy order should the debtor fail to pay the sum demanded”

In my case, the debts is just under £750, does this mean if PayPal refuses to pay the debt after the statutory demand I wouldn’t be able to apply for a winding up order or a bankruptcy!

I am not familiar at all with the court process, never been through this before so please guys accept my apology for keep asking for more and more information.

Thanks

waamo

Low value claims are notoriously difficult to enforce. Nobody wants the bother of chasing a small debt.

I would seriously consider if you would be throwing good money after bad. You now have a ccj against them. It might be worth just sitting tight for a couple of months and see if they notice. Alternatively you could write to their office in Luxembourg and tell them. It would be cheap and quick.

Enforcement action could cost significant sums with no guarantee of success. Have a think about things before you act.

Okrib

I am in a similar position and pondering my next course of action.

A customer order £429 worth of goods from my company. Two standard products (£240) and 1 custom product (£189). Standard products were delivered, custom one took longer than expected.

Buyer raised case after case with PayPal, then shut them down. Every time we responded, offered a refund, explained the delay. These claims were for the full £429 despite having already received £240 worth of products.

Finally, PayPal settled the case in the buyer's favour and gave him the £429 back. So the customer has all the products and not paid anything.

We have tracking numbers from TNT and proof of deliveries signed by the customer.

Raised a formal complaint against PayPal who responding saying they could not change the case verdict and that we hoped we understood why they made their decision.

On principal I am not going to let this go. It is scandalous.

Do I need to serve a legal notice to their address in Luxembourg or UK?

Sam1224

Firstly, I am so sorry to hear what you went through with PayPal.

As far as I know you won’t be able to take any legal action against PayPal in Luxembourg, you must use a UK address, use the Richmond address instead of the London one since they won’t accept any court paperwork sent by post to the registered London address.

Wish you the best of luck in retrieving your funds.