'Smart meters will save consumers just £11 a year' - MSE News

AndyPK

This is the annoying problems with the first generation. They stop working when you switch. And then the read them manually they are much more difficult. Pressing buttons and to see the numbers scroll across the display until it times out.

Plus the gas ones don't fit in the underground boxes correctly

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

Fitzmichael wrote: »

I was with BrGas and they offered Smart meters, which I accepted but I agree they're unlikely to save you money. Not long after, their price shot up so I switched to E.on and the meters switched off. Even though E.on were offering them, they said they could not read BrGas ones. This article makes me suspect that this is not because of how the meters work but because of how the info is sent/received or encoded. Does anyone at MSE know?
So my complaint is not that I can't watch the monitor like a hawk, but how difficult it now is to take a reading and submit it. I am 77 but could read the mechanical, clock-like displays without glasses; the digital ones are fainter, especially if I can’t shelter them from the sunlight – they’re in an outside cupboard. The gas meter is a particular problem. As in all the many houses I have lived in or seen, the gas meter is just above the floor/ground. I could see the (sharp, black) mechanical display by bending slightly and looking down on it but now I need to press a button and look more or less directly at the electronic display. This means kneeling on the ground outside the cupboard, bending full forward and tipping my head backwards. I had only looked in order to have a reading when switching, so when I pointed this out to Br Gas, I was told to "mention any vulnerabilities" to my new supplier, who said it was not their problem.
I have never considered whether I might qualify as ‘disabled’(and so, what?), when I am less so than some younger people but, in conversation with a surveyor some years ago, I mentioned how awkwardly positioned gas/electricity meters often seemed to be, and without reason, and he responded that that was because builders put them in where it was most convenient and cheapest for them and there was no regulation to make them have the least concern for the convenience of householders. I'm not surprised, unfortunately, that it has never concerned the local govt 'experts' who devise the Building Regulations.
I complained to the Ombudsman, got an acknowledgement, then nothing. I had a resurgence of my illness, and didn't persevere. Then, a week ago, I got this:
To: OS Enquiries (Energy)
Subject: Smart meters functionality
Sent: 18 May 2017 23:47:13 (UTC+00:00) Dublin, Edinburgh, Lisbon, London
was deleted without being read on 17 July 2018 11:54:13 (UTC+00:00) Dublin, Edinburgh, Lisbon, London.

Again, does anyone know whether the regulator has any power here, and does MSE have any care how a regulator can get away with this?

Hello Fitzmichael and I'm sorry reading the meters is causing you discomfort.

Have you registered with us to have smart meters? Even though you already have them, as they're not fully smart, we'll be looking to either replace or upgrade them. As they're BG meters, I suspect the former. Once changed/upgraded, readings will come through to us automatically and you'll be able to change supplier without losing smart features. You can register an interest through our website and we'll be in touch to let you know what we can do.

New meters will come with our latest In-Home Display. These will let you see your meter readings on the display without having to take them from the actual meters themselves.

In the meantime, as you're 77, you'll be on our Priority Services Register. This helps us recognise and provide free support to customers of pensionable age or with disabilities. It includes arranging for meters to be read quarterly. Could be useful until the meters are fully smart again. Let us know if you think it will help. There's more information about this and other related services on our website.

Let me know if you need any more information Fitzmichael as happy to help.

Malc

AndyPK

report

http://www.britishinfrastructuregroup.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/BIG-Not-So-Smart-Full-Report.pdf

only 450 SMETS 2 have been installed to date, with only 80
actually installed in the live environment;. These meters are in fact still undergoing testing, let alone mass manufacturing.

In January 2018, the government therefore yet
again had to push back the date at which these meters alone could be offered to
consumers from July - October 2018.

I wish I understood what the 370 are doing? A very big test setup or most of them were uninstalled?! and replaced??

However, although it is now 21 months since the foundation stage ended, and over 4 years since it was originally set to end, energy suppliers are still exclusively providing customers with these obsolete meters. In fact, in January 2018 the governent yet again extended the time in which suppliers could continue to offer these meters, from 13th July to 5th October 2018.0 Suppliers will also be allowed to install these obsolete meters in January 2019, if they were offered to customers prior to the October deadline.

It's not safe to say YES! until November 2018. Many think it will slip again

This issue arises following a customer!!!8217;s decision to switch suppliers, and sees the new supplier replace the pre-existing smart meter, even if it can receive data from it. It is caused by Meter Asset Providers (MAP) exploitatively charging the new supplier more to lease or rent the installed smart meter, than it costs the new supplier simply replace it with one of their own.78 In many cases the new smart meter may even be the exact same model as the one it replaced.

:rotfl:

Presently though less than half of those without a smart meter would like to receive one, with as few as 35% of contacted customers giving a positive response to the offer of one. Increasing demand through public engagement has accordingly been more difficult than anticipated, which in part has led to the budget for Smart Energy GB rising from £97m to £192m

Oh its our fault then for the £95m increase :wall:

Following the EU Directives to roll-out smart meters, every other European nation chose to do so through Distribution Network Operators (DNOs). The UK government however, believed that they would have fewer incentives to keep costs low, and so instructed energy suppliers to conduct the roll-out instead.99 As described in a subsequent government energy review though, this was !!!8220;a mistake with profound consequences!!!8221;. Not only have suppliers not kept costs low, but their commercial agreements, mismanaging of meter development, and own capacity issues have seriously hindered
rather than facilitated the efficient roll-out of energy smart meters.

but did so again this year, with British Gas, Npower and Scottish Power among others all stating that their recent increases of 5.1-5.5% were driven in part by rising smart meter costs.

However, research
shows that when confronted with the reality that smart meters would only help
them save "pennies" rather than "larger amounts", consumers "express
disappointment and frustration".
While they may therefore make initial changes following an installation, upon
learning that their actions would only save them around £11 in 2020, or 3p a day, there is no guarantee consumers will sustain such actions in the years after
installation, even with continued industry engagement attempts.

While suppliers can be very confident that the roll-out will result in significant savings for them, regardless of how energy use changes, the same cannot therefore be said for consumers. In fact the only aspect of the roll-out that consumers can be definitive about, is that they have shouldered the burden for it through their bills thus far, and will continue to do so through lower than expected savings.

...

Rather than recognise the precarious position consumers are in however, the
government has repeatedly maintained that market forces alone are sufficient to ensure that they will see a financial return. This position though is at odds with wider government policy, which displays such scepticism on the effectiveness of the energy market that an energy price cap is set to be introduced

My opinion. It needs scrapping/stopping. Evidence from other countries shows little money or energy is saved

Skools_Out

Does anyone know how I will be able to save £11 a year with a smart meter?

Will the supplier give me a special £11 a year discount (like some do similarly for say dual fuel or online account management)

Or will I have to have a special tariff? If so what are the details as surely that will then depend on my usage, etc?

Or is this £11 a year projected saving based upon an assumed reduction in my consumption?
If so, why can I not simply reduce my consumption and get the £11 a year saving with my existing meter???

AndyPK

The latter. We would all save much more than £11 a year if they cancelled the SM programme. But then we would have to pay for new power stations. I guess they aren't cheap either. :eek: And less environmentally friendly.

Skools_Out

Rather than saving people money, it sounds like smart meters are actually costing people money presently :eek:

Smart meters stop people getting a better energy deal, survey finds


Smart meters are deterring people from getting better deals by switching to a new electricity or gas supplier, a survey has found....

Read more here: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/07/28/smart-meters-stop-people-getting-better-energy-deal-survey-finds/

ProDave

I have always maintained a smart meter is for the benefit of the energy suppliers NOT the customer.

You already have the ability to monitor your usage with an ordinary meter. I just do nor subscribe to the idea that someone is going to look at a display and say oh that oven is using too much electricity, I will turn it off. Oh hold on why is my dinner cold?

The hidden agenda is, and always has been half hourly metering so you can be billed at a higher rate at peak times. I just wish they would be honest and say this is what we have to do as it's the only way to make the supply system cope.

quiet_advisor

The Smart escapade goes all the way back to Ed Milliband (if people can remember him) when he was Energy Minister.

I was told at the time by people in the Dept of Energy that he was one of the most ineffective Ministers they had experienced.

Certainly the evidence at the time justifying Smart was very questionable, with some flaky (but enthusiastic) academic research in support. It would be helpful if Ofgem/BEIS had the confidence to revisit and recalibrate the original cost benefit that justified the decision to go, but its unlikely. There are £billions at stake here as well as reputations, so it doesn't surprise me that no one will call a halt - too many self interests. It's absolutely no use for the customer to say that the Emperor has no clothes - no one will believe!

Norman_Castle

Skools_Out wrote: »

why can I not simply reduce my consumption and get the £11 a year saving with my existing meter???

You can. The idea of smart meters is to show what is using the energy, this can be done by plug in monitors and education. I had a spare plug in monitor which I gave away three times. Each time it was returned to me, too complicated, can't be arsed, I'll just use what I need. Smart meters will get the same response from 90% of consumers.

AndyPK wrote: »

But then we would have to pay for new power stations.

Decades ago I remember reading how a town in Norway, 500 miles from other towns, avoided building a new power station by giving everyone low energy bulbs. New technology, intervention over what is sold and educating Luddites, (500 watt vacuums must be crap because the Daily Mail said so) will save much more than a largely ignored in house display.

Norman_Castle

quiet_advisor wrote: »

The Smart escapade goes all the way back to Ed Milliband (if people can remember him)

He's been guest presenting on Radio 2. He made Jeremy Vine sound interesting.