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PCN - driver left site

edited 30 November -1 at 1:00AM in Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking
20 replies 1.6K views
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  • FruitcakeFruitcake Forumite
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    nisob wrote: »
    Hi Fruitcake,

    Thank you very much. So the following has been gathered as a process:
    1. The keeper should send the Newbies forum's ''ONE SIZE FITS ALL'' template appeal to UKPC on day 26.
    2. When the challenge is rejected then approach POPLA with the following appeal:
    - The signage fails BPA requirements, lettering of £100 fine is too small
    - The signs do not define "the site" or show a map detailing the limits of "the site" therefore a motorist could not know if or when they have left "the site."

    Much thanks.. This forum is so helpful.

    That's just two appeal points. You should use those plus ALL the other relevant ones from post 3 of the NEWBIES that apply.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
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  • nisobnisob Forumite
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    Hi Umkomaas,
    Does it say anything at all about 'leaving the site'. Can you get a better close-up?

    The height of the signage did not allow enough focus of the camera and unfortunately this was the best that could be done. About leaving the site it says:

    "If you leave the site whilst the vehicle remains in the car park you may be liable to receive a parking charge."

    The letters on site were so small that one had to really stare on the signage for couple of minutes to understand what it is saying.

    I shall type down the entire notice message this evening.
    Your photo of where the car was parked needs to be cropped to eliminate the sign (play UKPC at their own game!). You need photos that cannot be used against you. It's unlikely that UKPC will have photo evidence of every single angle of the car park.

    Is this cropped image recommended for use in current appeal stage or POPLA stage? How can it be used to play UKPC (apologies if it is a naive question)?
    The photo evidences of the car on UKPCs' paycharge website were just now checked and the warden has submitted the image of the car parked in the bay with the signage close to it. The warden took images from quite a lot of angles.
    And what are you hoping to say? What are you hoping to achieve? (Note - 'Cancellation' is the wrong answer!).

    I shall get back to you on this later this evening.

    Much appreciated!!
  • nisobnisob Forumite
    8 posts
    Fruitcake wrote: »
    That's just two appeal points. You should use those plus ALL the other relevant ones from post 3 of the NEWBIES that apply.

    Thanks, I will have a look into it once again, do an in-depth reading and get back. Much appreciated,
  • FruitcakeFruitcake Forumite
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    Initial appeal template from the NEWBIES exactly as it appears. Nowt added and nowt taken away.

    Save everything else for PoPLA.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister. :D
    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
  • UmkomaasUmkomaas Forumite
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    I shall type down the entire notice message this evening.
    No need. Get your initial appeal in at day 26 (make sure you give the keeper's name and postal address) and hopefully this will drag UKPC away from going to the DVLA to access the data as well as not sending out a PoFA-compliant NtK, then it's a simple 'No Keeper Liability' win at POPLA.
    play UKPC at their own game!

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3229165/Is-PROOF-private-parking-firms-scamming-motorists-Drivers-say-timings-photos-doctored-legally-parked-cars-issued-fines.html
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
  • nisobnisob Forumite
    8 posts
    And what are you hoping to say? What are you hoping to achieve? (Note - 'Cancellation' is the wrong answer!).


    Hi Umkomaas,

    Apologies, due to some personal problems, I could not reply to you yesterday evening. The only change I am making to the Newbies Thread "One Size Fits all" appeal template is reducing it to the point only.

    Please see the draft as follows:

    Re PCN number:

    I appeal and dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability.

    There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn, nor was there an agreed contract. Your signage terms fail the test of 'large lettering' and prominence of the parking charge, as established in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis, which is fully distinguished.

    Should you fail to cancel this PCN, I require with your rejection letter, all images taken of this vehicle & the signs at the location that day. Do not withhold any images or data later relied on for POPLA/court.

    [STRIKE]Firms of your ilk were unanimously condemned in 2018 as operating an 'outrageous scam' (Hansard 2.2.18). The BPA & IPC were heavily criticised too; hardly surprising for an industry where so-called AOS members admit to letting victims 'futilely go through the motions' of appeal and say on camera 'we make it up sometimes' (BBC Watchdog).

    I will be making a formal complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner, as well as complaining in writing to my MP and ensuring that they are appraised of the debate where Parliament agreed unanimously: ''we need to crack down on these rogue companies. They are an absolute disgrace to this country. Ordinary motorists...should not have to put up with this''. [/STRIKE]
    //Comments: I am thinking of removing the striked section as it sounds rough, apologies for saying this, I appreciate how helpful this template is. Removing this doesn't mean that I won't send a complaint to my MP.


    Formal note:

    Service of any rejection letter/POPLA code and/or legal documents by email is expressly disallowed. All responses to me from this point on, must be made by post. Regardless of any MCOL online/email system, service of any court claim must only be made by first class post to the latest address provided by me.

    Yours faithfully,


    Many thanks for supporting!
  • Coupon-madCoupon-mad Forumite
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    That's fine to remove if it isn't your style.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • edited 31 July 2018 at 3:04PM
    nisobnisob Forumite
    8 posts
    edited 31 July 2018 at 3:04PM
    Umkomaas wrote: »
    No need. Get your initial appeal in at day 26 (make sure you give the keeper's name and postal address) and hopefully this will drag UKPC away from going to the DVLA to access the data as well as not sending out a PoFA-compliant NtK, then it's a simple 'No Keeper Liability' win at POPLA.




    Hello,

    I posted the newbies template appeal as registered keeper on the 26th day and received a response letter (dated 27th July) from UKPC yesterday. Scan of the letter is in the link below. (please look out for asteriks)
    h**ps://ibb.co/eUY8B8

    It asks for driver's full name and address and evidence that the onsite facilities were used to our Appeals Department within fourteen days of the date of this letter. Failure to provide this information will give no alternative other than to make final decision based on the previous information received. At this stage a POPLA verification code will be provided.

    I have read similar forums and a suggestion was given to ignore this letter and wait for POPLA stage. Is it safe to do so?

    Thanks
  • nosferatu1001nosferatu1001 Forumite
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    Yes, of course. Theyre fishing.
  • Le_KirkLe_Kirk Forumite
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    You have your answer from nosferatu1001 but here, for completeness, is your link made live (after checking): -
    https://ibb.co/eUY8B8
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