court claim received gladstone

jollyroger10

Hello members of MSE forum,

I've received a Claim Form from Gladstones Solicitors on behalf of UK Car Park Management Limited for a PCN received two years ago.

They're charging £160 for PCN - rounded to '£179.94 including £19.94 interest' + £25 Court Fee + £50 legal representative's fee.

I did the wrong thing at the time and ignored the PCN and subsequent letters completely.

The residential estates where i lives car park is a mixture of a car permit car park spaces, (monitored by ukpcm) and parking spaces belonging to a housing association whose spaces require no permit. I am a resident of the housing association but still part of the same residential estate.

The PCN is issued based on no permit being displayed. I am the registered keeper of the vehicle.

The car park where I live is overcrowded, on this particular occasion the car was temporarily parked in a visitors space in the private ukcpm monitored part of our residential address until a space was once again available in our permitted parking area.

I have read through the NEWBIES sticky thread (thank you so much for providing this it has answered so many questions and I am feeling confident about starting my draft defence letter) but what i would like some guidance on is if i can use the arguments and points i have found as a resident of the estate or not.

I have looked in my tenancy agreement which states the following on parking
"You may use designated parking spaces on our land when parking your vehicle."
So although the land in which the visitors space is (where car was parked at time of PCN) is 2 meters from our HA allocated spaces and housing associations land, it is were the ukcpm signs start and has a V painted on the space so belongs to the land of the private residential parking.

The residential estates name is included in my address aswell as the permit only spaces address given in ticket. I am not sure if it comes down to within the estate who owns which land and spaces or if i can still use the residential defence as joint landowners or that its within 2 meters of my address and usual space. In addition it being a visitors space so not belonging to an individual home.

If not any advice on what angle to best base my defence from would be greatly appreciated.
I have read many threads and draft letters but as i am unsure of my situation which arguments apply to my case.

I have followed step one of the small claims newbies advice and have applied for the extension for 28 days on the money claim web page successfully.

Many thanks in advance for any help i really appreciate the time that goes into helping people like myself who have no idea on these sorts of things and have learnt so much already.:T:)

Coupon-mad

I have looked in my tenancy agreement which states the following on parking
"You may use designated parking spaces on our land when parking your vehicle."

That's good. Very vague/ambiguous, but in your favour. Is ALL the land HA land?

jollyroger10

Hi Coupon mad,

Thank you for your for quick reply!

No HA don't own entire estate. So some of the land is definitely the allocated parking spaces of the privately owned properties. The residents of those particular buildings can apply for permits but we cannot.

We are given use of three areas for HA tenants to park in. The Issue is all the spaces are very close on the estate.

The visitor space in question is one of two spaces that are directly opposite the HA property and would look as if they come under the land of the HA, they are not joined to the other rows of private residents spaces.

The address is the same on PCN and my own address and we are all on same residential estate, so I am hoping as a resident of that estate with the same address I could still submit the defence as a residential defence. I am not sure if a Map of where the exact lines of land change ownership would be used in the hearing. We are still contributing to the costs of the estate and are part of that address.

thank you again sorry if this is confusing, really just want the defence of the PCN to be as strong as possible.

System

I am not sure if a Map of where the exact lines of land change ownership would be used in the hearing

They won't provide one, so best you get one. Paint on the ground is not ownership - so check who actually owns / manages those spaces. Talk to the LA Housing Department first as they will confirm.

jollyroger10

Hi there,

Thank you , yes I called them on Thursday and am waiting for them to call me back with answer. Will be chasing it up Monday.

The spaces in question are defientley managed by the ukcpm and are for visitors of the private owned flats. Which leads me to think the spaces come under the land of the private properties.

Overall we live on same estate so to a judge I’m hoping as a resident who’s vehicle had a need to park within the keepers home address the residential defence will be ok to use, as that is the only reason the space was needed.

Thanks again for advice guys

System

Which leads me to think the spaces come under the land of the private properties.

If it is private, you'll have an issue.

so to a judge I!!!8217;m hoping as a resident who!!!8217;s vehicle had a need to park within the keepers home address the residential defence will be ok to use

No it won't. Silly example but think of a parking space you don't own in the same way as bedroom you don't own. The Goldilocks example. What if someone found you in that space and what would you do.

Property (like parking spaces) has a very special place in law and very strong protection against people who take or misuse it.

That's good. Very vague/ambiguous, but in your favour

CM's point from above is the best one you can use if the land comes back as not owned by the HA.

jollyroger10

Yes I do completely see what you mean. Bit of wishful thinking on part.. Fingers crossed they come under the land of the HA.

If this is not the case then do you still think I can use the above quote from my tenenacy agreement as it!!!8217;s quite vague.

In addition should my Defense be based around the failure to comply with laws when issuing tickets , inappropriate communication , unknown driver at the time etc....

I!!!8217;m sorry if I am asking silly things I have read lots and lots of threads and doing my own reasearch just want to make sure I know what points I can use in my individual case before showing my Defense draft.

Thank you

The_Deep

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and another company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

Hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned.

The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by Christmas.

jollyroger10

Hello again,

I have had a series of telephone conversations with my housing association on which i was told "As far as they were concerned any bays outside the property and the car park opposite is available to their residents" (the car park opposite is where the visitors bay is where car received ticket) I have been chasing them for this to be put in an official letter to me or in an email back to myself so i can use it to form part of my defence.

This however is the reply i finally received.

Dear Ms XXX

In reference to your recent enquiry regarding parking around these blocks:

The residents parking provision is available to the bays in front of each block, HOUSING ASSOCIATION are unaware of, or personally enforce any parking restrictions to this area.
The wider estate is privately owned and the arrangements are managed through other agents and out of our control.

So i am guessing this is not useful to include in my defence? I am keen to share my defence draft on here but as i am not sure wether to include the defence used by residents it is still not complete.

Would you recommend still stating the residential rights defence based on the early quote that i shared on here from my tenancy agreement

"You may use designated parking spaces on our land when parking your vehicle."

or am i best to leave my defence with the basis that no contract was agreed to, they haven't followed correct procedures , inflated costs, robocaims ect...

hope this all makes sense, thank you for your help and time

Coupon-mad

Can you email back and ask for the site boundary map, showing what constitutes the 'wider estate'? Then you can ask the Land Registry who owns that land.

jollyroger10

Hi Coupon mad,

Great yes I will reply with this question, hopefully I will get a quicker response this time as it!!!8217;s took a week to just get that.

I am on day 12 since the date of issue on court claim so hopefully got time to get this info. I did the AOS so still got awhile wanted to send it by end of next week.

Thank you