Threat from neighbour to remove scaffolding for loft conversion project

Loft_conversion

Hello,

We live on the top floor of a block of flats and between us we all own the freehold.
Two years ago we purchased the communal loft space above our flat. We were open from the start regarding our intentions to develop the loft space as a loft and mansard conversion in due course and there were no objections. The money went into the communal funds to be used on building maintenance when needed.


We have obtained all the legal documents required when taking on a loft conversion within a block of flats (licence for alteration from our management company, party wall notices from our neighbours, council planning permission, adhering to article 11 requirements etc) We even notified our neighbours prior to official planning permission being requested giving them additional chance to contact us. We had no objections or questions and planning permission was granted.


Prior to our conversion external maitainance work was carried out to our building (the money we used to purchase the space was used to reduce the levy required to pay for the work by each individual flat). This required scaffolding to be erected to complete this work.
To avoid disruption to our neighbours we made sure we had all our documents ready by the time this was finished so the scaffolding did not have to be taken down and then instantly erected again. We made our intentions very transparent and once again no issues were raised. We paid the scaffolders to keep the scaffolding up for the duration of our project.

Two weeks into our conversion we received an email from a friend of the owner in the ground floor flat asking a list of questions. One of which “why was the conversion taking so long?” In addition to saying the scaffolding was in their back garden and therefore they could not use it / limiting natural light etc.

We replied answering all the questions and apologised for any inconvenience. We brought to their attention they had not raised any concerns over the past two years and the 6 months prior to this when we had approached all residents before the official three month planning permission was posted. In short we had completed all the legal protocol required without objection or issue.


We are now commencing the third week of our project and have received a reply demanding rent of £75 per day to have the scaffolding in the garden beyond the end of June until the project is finished. Our builders, who are working 6 day weeks, are expecting to complete everything by the start of August, weather permitting. If we do not agree with this condition (personally we feel it is rather excessive) then they will have the scaffolding removed.

We have checked our lease on the property which is worded the same for each flat and it clearly states “...the lessee hereby covenants with the lessor...at all reasonable times permits the lessor and (as respects work in connection with any other parts of the building) its lessees with workmen and others to enter into and upon the demised premises or any part thereof for the purpose of repairing or altering any part of the building or any adjoining or contiguous premises and for the purpose of making constructing repairing maintaining supporting rebuilding cleansing lighting...or additions thereto”

We would like to know if their threats have any legal ground and do we have to comply? Are they legally able to remove the scaffolding without any permission or consent?

Apologies for the length but any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

PasturesNew

Dunno ... but it's a bit of a b4st4rd when we finally get some GREAT weather if you've that looming over your outlook and blocking light out for an entire summer! I'd have expected "Oh they'll be in/out in 2 weeks I bet... 3 at a push".

Do they own the garden? Or is it owned by the freehold, used under license?

Aylesbury_Duck

As above. Who owns the garden and does the ground floor flat have exclusive use of it or is it a communal garden?

I wouldn't have thought they'd be allowed to remove it, but that's a point to check with your solicitor. I'm sure they wouldn't start to remove it themselves so are they thinking that they'll somehow pay a scaffolder to dissemble it and then pass that cost onto you?

Bear in mind the "cost" of having a poor neighbourly relationship if they aren't allowed to remove it and you carry on. Although it will have saved money not having to have scaffolding taken down and re-erected when you start work, the unquantifiable cost of disgruntled neighbours may outweigh it.

roger-w5

scaffolding and complaints,had a few over the years.
You should really have planned your work so your neighbour's gets some respite from the scaffolding,if its been up for 6 weeks for the external block maintenance then a break of 6 weeks would be reasonable.
Can you scaffold supervisor/company liaise with your neighbour,an alteration could be possible to satisfy your neighbour,this has worked for us on several occasions and cheaper than involving lawyers.
we have in the past entered into a contract to rent a part of a ground floor residents garden,for our scaffold.
Seems cash payment makes the inconvenience of scaffold disappear,funny old world.

Jonesya

I'm guessing your neighbour doesn't object to you converting the loft, but that doesn't mean they are happy to have scaffolding in their garden for several months. They're two different issues.

The neighbour seems to be giving you 6, 7 weeks to complete your work, which assuming it's their garden, seems pretty reasonable.

Doozergirl

Jonesya wrote: »

I'm guessing your neighbour doesn't object to you converting the loft, but that doesn't mean they are happy to have scaffolding in their garden for several months. They're two different issues.

The neighbour seems to be giving you 6, 7 weeks to complete your work, which assuming it's their garden, seems pretty reasonable.

What is reasonable is to allow the time it takes to convert the loft. Leases should be quite explicit in allowing neighbours the right to work on their property. Without charge.

I'm sure it isn't nice having scaffolding over the front of the house in the summer. Perhaps it can be altered to help them a bit, so speak to the scaffolders, but the neighbour's threats are empty. Not only do they have no right to place those demands, the reality of a lay person trying to safely remove three storeys or more of scaffolding is slightly different to writing down a ridiculous threat. I wouldn't fancy trying it.

I don't know why people can't be polite to each other. They'd get more done by being nice about it. I'd be sure to point out that much of the timescale was actually maintenance to benefit you ALL.

Taking the scaffoliding down and putting it back up again to gove the neighbours respite would be horrendously expensive. The cost of scaffolding itself is shocking, but the major costs come in the labour associated with the erection and dismantling of it.

Norman_Castle

If we do not agree with this condition (personally we feel it is rather excessive) then they will have the scaffolding removed.

Removed by who? Will one company remove anothers scaffold?


Make it clear that the initial scaffold was not for your conversion and explain the expected timescale. I doubt they have any right to charge for necessary access.
If they interfere with the scaffold I suspect you could claim costs against them.

Jonesya

Doozergirl wrote: »

What is reasonable is to allow the time it takes to convert the loft. Leases should be quite explicit in allowing neighbours the right to work on their property. Without charge.

How long it takes isn't fixed, it depends how the job is being done and how many people you have working on it.

The neighbour seems to think 6 to 7 weeks is reasonable to have the scaffolding up, the Op wants an extra 4 weeks. They'll either have yo come to an agreement or the OK will have to get the external work finished and scaffold down sooner.

Doozergirl

Jonesya wrote: »

How long it takes isn't fixed, it depends how the job is being done and how many people you have working on it.

The neighbour seems to think 6 to 7 weeks is reasonable to have the scaffolding up, the Op wants an extra 4 weeks. They'll either have yo come to an agreement or the OK will have to get the external work finished and scaffold down sooner.

No they won't. The neighbour is obliged to accommodate.

Loft_conversion

Hi guys

Thanks for all your comments, very helpful. We completely sympathise with their situation and will obviously take the scaffolding down as soon as our guys are done. We’ll have a word with our builders to see what they can do in meantime.

Thanks again.

ComicGeek

For the sake of neighbourly relations, I would be looking to give them a couple of bottles of wine and some money - not £75/day, but say £200 for a night away. Regardless of the legal situation, I would be absolutely fuming to lose the use of the garden during the summer.

If your builders are working 6 days a week it doesn't really provide much relief - and that can be a seriously depressing situation, I've been there! A short break from it makes all the difference, and personally I think you've been very selfish not providing a break between the building maintenance and the conversion - you've done it to save yourself money, so why not use some of that to repair relations.