Advice for mother leaving father

Iamadored

At the risk of getting my head bitten off again (I reiterate, this is only my opinion, and it may not be legally correct), I can sympathise with your mother not wanting the hassle of a divorce at her age.

Judicial separation is not something I've heard of, but sounds very promising.

However, the only way, I suspect, that you might persuade her to proceed with any legal action, is if you guarantee to help her every step of the way. Which means holding her hand throughout.

The alternative is to do nothing.

Her half of the cash is, I expect, currently in accounts in her sole name? If so, even if she does not divorce or separate, he will be unable to touch any of it, without her agreement. And there is nothing to stop her writing a Will and bequeathing all the money to her children.

The house is a different kettle of fish because it is jointly owned. If she does nothing, and dies first, he will become the sole owner, no ifs or buts about it.
But, by the same token, if he dies first, she will automatically become the sole owner.

The only other issue is, by continuing to live with him, he will continue to be in a position to steal her belongings and sell them.

If I have said anything that is incorrect, I am sure someone will correct me.

marliepanda

Iamadored wrote: »

Isn't that what I said?

No, you said:

But he will have to agree to do this, and I don’t see that happening.

Iamadored

By which I meant, changing from a jointly-owned property to a tennants-in-common arrangement will require his agreement, which he is unlikely to provide.

Iamadored

The only thing I would add is that the OP's mother should take into consideration her own quality of life and peace of mind.

If she takes no action, she could have another couple of decades of friction and upset, versus a couple of years of upheaval to legally break away from him.

However, she is 73, so the OP will probably need to take the lead in this, and do most of the work, in order to keep the distress and upheaval, for both parents, to a minimum.

Kynthia

Iamadored wrote: »

By which I meant, changing from a jointly-owned property to a tennants-in-common arrangement will require his agreement, which he is unlikely to provide.

Then other posters stated it doesn't require his agreement.

BrassicWoman

Iamadored wrote: »

However, she is 73, so the OP will probably need to take the lead in this, and do most of the work, in order to keep the distress and upheaval, for both parents, to a minimum.

I think you may have an outdated view of when people go gaga.

jackieblack

Iamadored wrote: »

By which I meant, changing from a jointly-owned property to a tennants-in-common arrangement will require his agreement, which he is unlikely to provide.

This is incorrect.

marliepanda has already posted this link https://www.gov.uk/joint-property-ownership/change-from-joint-tenants-to-tenants-in-common which states:
Change from joint tenants to tenants in common
This is called 'severance of joint tenancy'. You should apply for a 'Form A restriction'.
You can make this change without the other owners agreement.

Giving your opinion is one thing, repeatedly stating things which are factually incorrect (and have been shown to be so) is quite another.

jackieblack

OP, I do agree with Iamadored in that your mum's quality of life should be priority.

If the savings aren't already in accounts in her sole name she should sort this asap.
Then get the house transferred into tenants-in-common and either get any other joint accounts closed or have her name removed.

If she wants to separate from your father, she then has two options.
She can then leave, without divorcing. She may need to rent somewhere to live but can keep him from accessing whatever is in her sole name and stop him from taking any more of her possessions. She won't have access to his pension, but will have the separation and peace of mind she needs in order to improve her quality of life.
Or
She can leave and file for divorce. In due course this will necessitate formalising the split of their finances. She will probably be entitled to a share of his pension, he may be entitled to a share of her savings and the court can order the house to be sold. However, if they can't reach an amicable agreement (which sounds unlikely) the legal fees could be considerable, even to the point of wiping out the savings.

Either way, once the house is transferred to tenants-in-common she can make a new will leaving her share of the house, and her savings, to whoever she chooses. Her will should state that she is separated from her husband and that is the reason why he is not a beneficiary.

marliepanda

jackieblack wrote: »

This is incorrect.

marliepanda has already posted this link https://www.gov.uk/joint-property-ownership/change-from-joint-tenants-to-tenants-in-common which states:
Change from joint tenants to tenants in common
This is called 'severance of joint tenancy'. You should apply for a 'Form A restriction'.
You can make this change without the other owners agreement.

Giving your opinion is one thing, repeatedly stating things which are factually incorrect (and have been shown to be so) is quite another.

Thank you Jackieblack, and just putting this out there AGAIN.

Nobody is an expert in everything and I certainly don’t know anything about divorcing luckily, but I can use the information around to help guide me. Continually posting incorrect info (after being corrected with gov links) could directly affect how someone proceeds.

TBagpuss

panicproject wrote: »

Hi all,

I will keep this as brief as I can.

My mother wants to leave my father and sell the house.
They have been married for over 40 years but the marriage is finished due to his alcoholism.
He wanted to split their savings when he retired, which my mother reluctantly agreed to. He spent all of his half (over £30,000) in a couple of years on alcohol and the lottery.
After that was gone he started on their bank reserve money and then the overdraft.
It was only then my mother asked me to step in and for the past 2 years I have been controlling their finances to make sure bills get paid etc.
Things went from bad to worse when it was noticed that he had been stealing my mums possessions, selling them and buying alcohol with the money he got for them.
She has had enough and wants to sell the house and leave him.

She has concerns and questions though.

She wants to leave him but she is not sure whether to divorce or not.

She wants to change her will so that if anything happens to her, her money does not go to him as she knows how it will be spent. Also the will states her half of the house will go to him, she no longer wants that.

She is also concerned that if she leaves him she does not know if he can come after the money she has saved, which is still a chunk of the money that was split a few years back.

The main pension that comes into the house is in his name. It gets automatically transferred by me into my mums account that he does not have access to so that bills can be covered and he does not spend it on alcohol.
My mum is concerned that if anything happens to her he will get her money savings.

Any advice would be great. If you need to know any finer details please ask and I will reply ASAP.

Thanks.

She wants to leave him but she is not sure whether to divorce or not.

She can leave him, and then decide whether to divorce him. However, in order to get a financial settlement sorted out she will need to either divorce him or apply for judicial separation. Both processes are similar., JS doesn't leave her free to marry again but may be more cost effective in terms of pensions,

She wants to change her will so that if anything happens to her, her money does not go to him as she knows how it will be spent. Also the will states her half of the house will go to him, she no longer wants that.
If they are currently Joint Tenants, she will first ned to sever the joint tenancy. She can then make a new will. She neds to see a solicitor to get proper advice and they will be able to deal with the severing of the joint tenancy for her. Please be aware that for the joint tenancy to be severedm, your dad MUSTY be served with the notice, so will know she has taken this step. There is no way round that!

She is also concerned that if she leaves him she does not know if he can come after the money she has saved, which is still a chunk of the money that was split a few years back.
Yes, he can. The court (if they can't agree between themselves) looks at the assets as they are at the time any order is made, and has to try to reach a settlements which is fair to both parties, taking ton account a range of factors including their ages, length of marriage, needs, resources etc. Behaviour and prior agreements may be relevant, but 'need' is usually the single most important factor.

That said, things are not going to get any better, so she may do better to cut her losses now rather than waiting in the hopes that things will change.


The main pension that comes into the house is in his name. It gets automatically transferred by me into my mums account that he does not have access to so that bills can be covered and he does not spend it on alcohol.

Within a divorce or JS, the court can make orders relatin to pensions so she would have some income in her own right. How this is done would depend on the pension, and whether they go down the JS or divorce route.

My mum is concerned that if anything happens to her he will get her money savings.

Unless she makes a new will, he will. Even if she makes a will, he will be entitled to anything in an account in joint names and would be eligible to make a claim under the inheritance act if she fails to make reasonable provision for him. So if she decides not to go down the route of divorce or JS she should see a solicitor about making a will and how to reduce the risk of him being able to make a successful claim on her estate, if she were to pass first.