Incorrect images of car on PCN

malefic

Evening all.


I know someone who has received a PCN (and its not me - sounds dodgy from the start doesn't it!) for overstaying in a car park with ANPR.



When I took a look at it the "in " image is exactly the same as the "out" image but with a different time stamp on it.


When we went to appeal it the images on the website were not the same as what the person had received. The "in" one was still the same, but the "out" one was different but with the same date / time details as the incorrect "out" image on the PCN.


Could this help with the appeal letter - there are other technicalities that I will check out tomorrow at the actual car park but if an inaccurate PCN is all thats needed then I save myself a few miles driving to take some photos for the person I am trying to help (mainly due to I helped someone else, with help found in this forum, get a PCN overturned).

Thanks and good evening!

Castle

Is it a BPA company?

malefic

Sorry - should of said to start with, its Vehicle Control Services and after looking this evening they appear to be on both the BPA list (trading as Flashpark) and also on the IPC list as VCS Ltd.


Didn't think they could be on both lists but as the PCN says 21 days to pay up I am guessing they are on the IPC.


** EDIT - sorry, its the IPC, the company on BPA is Vehicle Control Solutions, not Services but VCS has badges for BPA on its site which makes it confusing!**

Umkomaas

There's no appeal process that will see a cancellation with an IPC AOS operator. We do recommend sending the initial appeal template to the PPC to show engagement in their process in an attempt to resolve the issue (but they will reject out of hand - no profit in upholding appeals).

Thereafter, its ignore everything (including any misguided temptation to appeal further to the IAS). The only response should be to a LBC or MCOL (see NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #5 for acronyms) - come back on this thread if either is received.

It's far better that the actual keeper of the vehicle is posting here and receiving advice directly. Chinese whispers, 'Send three and four pence, were going to a dance'!

How did the complaint to the landowner go?

malefic

Thanks for the advice - I did read the NEWBIE thread again, very useful. Landowner chat is today when we go over to take a look at something I think will smash it out the water anyway.

Will send the appeal and see what happens - maybe see you all when we get some fluffy legal BS through the post

Thanks again.

malefic

Okay - went to the car park in question today and now understand why VCS thought the car in question had been parked in the car park for more than the 3 hours maximum time.


The car park has ANPR on the main entrance and exit but at the other end of the car park is an exit that is not covered by any ANPR camera. The driver of the car came in through the main entrance (ANPR image coming in) and left through the open exit (not ANPR'd) and drove away.


A little later the driver came back to the same car park, again via the main entrance and left a little later through the main exit (ANPR image going out).


I think the ANPR system discounted the second entrance to the car park as it didn't see the car leave (as it left via the other exit that has no ANPR on it) and took the total parking time from the first entrance to the second exit.


I believe the driver of the car was fine coming back in after a short while as the sign, which is quite high up on poles, does not mention anything along the "no return in some many hours" line.



I am a little unsure how the ANPR system works but would the above make sense to anyone else?


I have taken photographs of the main entrance where the ANPR cameras monitor the in and out lanes and have also taken (multiple) shots of the second exit with no cameras anywhere near it.

What do I do on the appeals page - put the above in or just go with the normal templated text?

Thanks.

Redx

send the template and add a note that the driver made 2 short visits that day and their ANPR data is incorrect and you believe they are trying something known as a "double dipping" invoice


also tell them that pictures of the cameras (or lack of cameras) have been taken by the keeper and will be used in any court proceedings



this is a common issue known as "double dipping" , so google it and read about it on parking pranksters website etc



do not tell them who was driving

malefic

Brilliant - thanks RedX

Coupon-mad

Do you have Google Location on your phone, to show evidence of leaving & returning?

Guys_Dad

Get photos of the non ANPR exit for your defence and possibly Google map evidence too.

In this case, I would appeal to the IAS if the PPC turns you down, but only on the very clear point you have made of 2 entry photos plus no ANPR on exit with your own photographic evidence.

malefic

Guys_Dad wrote: »

Get photos of the non ANPR exit for your defence and possibly Google map evidence too.

In this case, I would appeal to the IAS if the PPC turns you down, but only on the very clear point you have made of 2 entry photos plus no ANPR on exit with your own photographic evidence.

Plenty of photos taken - looked like a wierd tourist with a fetish of car parks!!


Didn't think of the Google Maps - just checked, no cameras displayed on the second exit on their either from 2017.


Wonder how many people haven't thought of that and coughed up to this lot?!