Victorian Terrace Right of way

theartfullodger

sme116 wrote: »

Thanks for your help, land registry just has a red line around our house and garden and the same with our neighbours, it doesnt state who if anyone owns the alleyway. ........

Have you bothered to look at what you can do on Land Registry? Your posts reads as though you haven't....

You need the "Aerial Land Locator" ..see

https://eservices.landregistry.gov.uk/eservices/FindAProperty/view/Info.do?page=land_loc_one&id=p_locator_link

If you've already tried this, apologies..

shortcrust

From my mental picture if I were a neighbour I’d not be happy. I can imagine staking a claim to the bit at the bottom of my garden. Perhaps a raised bed for some veg or the like.

bouicca21

TBH, I would have thought that fencing it off, with gates at either side so the neighbours could exercise ROW if they so chose would be fine. The person most likely to object might be the one in (presumably) the next street that also backs on to the alley.

These alleys were once useful for delivery of coal, the collection of bins and movement of large bits of furniture. Nowadays they are often gated and locked to deter burglars.

Aylesbury_Duck

bouicca21 wrote: »

The person most likely to object might be the one in (presumably) the next street that also backs on to the alley.

Exactly. Their view might reasonably be: Why should the neighbour at the back of me claim all of the land that's between us on the basis its ownership is unknown? I now have a boundary with a neighbour that I didn't have before, with all that that entails (arguments about fences, hedges, etc).

moneyistooshorttomention

Aylesbury_Duck wrote: »

Exactly. Their view might reasonably be: Why should the neighbour at the back of me claim all of the land that's between us on the basis its ownership is unknown? I now have a boundary with a neighbour that I didn't have before, with all that that entails (arguments about fences, hedges, etc).

I'm guessing the neighbour behind would do what I would do if I spotted OP grabbing half the width of the alley. I would turn round quicksharp and make sure whatever they put in as a boundary feature came to an absolute EXACT halfway mark across the alley and put my own boundary feature bang up against it - so they couldnt claim my half-side of our alley as well.

The one experience I've had of this though was the neighbour across the back alley from me in my last house just starting in on trying to lay "his stuff" right across my half width of the alley as well. Fortunately - the Council owned our alley and I told the neighbour quicksharp to stop immediately, or I'd tell the Council. As it turned out - I was correct in assuming he was trying to grab my side as well - as he didnt even put in "his stuff" on his side of our alley after that.

Norman_Castle

Its likely to be a privately row for the residents use only. I would fence it at the sides to incorporate it into the garden and see what happens. Presumably the neighbours have seen you clearing it. If its only a meter wide and unused by anyone for 15+ years its likely neighbouring properties won't care and may do the same. The neighbour at the foot of the garden may wan't their half and its difficult to argue against that.
Just avoid spending a lot of money on the area and be willing to give it up if required.
Take lots of photographs of the area to support any claims of incorrect boundaries..

now that we are re-doing our garden we will no longer have a gate to get into the alleyway to clear it

Why not put a gate in or just leave a gap in the fence to keep the area clear and use it as garden storage or similar.

ProDave

Didn't the OP state both ends of the alley are blocked off (how?) so nobody can use it, except perhaps to get from one garden to another.

G_M

As artfullodger sys, check the map search function at the LR. (do a map search).

There may be a registered Title for tthe plot/strip of land that has no address (likely described as "land to the west or number 2 - 14 Somewhere Street" or similar.

Even if nothing is registered does not mean it is not owned. There are large sections of still unregistered land. They only get registered when they get sold, so a 'back' like tis is unlikely to have needed to be registered.

Could be owned by the original farmer (well, his successors) on whose land tthe houses were originally built 150 years ago. Or the developer. or someone else.

YoungBlueEyes

I'd say it's owned by someone, just not registered.

I live in a victorian terrace. Our back alley (we call them 10foots) runs along the outside of our walled gardens. Opposite is the side of the first house on the road round the corner from us (if that makes sense). He decided he was going to lose the garden along the side of his house and build another house attached to his, and claim the 10foot so that they would have a side garden. It's called "in-filling" apparently. First we knew about it was when he knocked his fence down one Easter weekend. Me and a neighbour we out to see what all the noise was (we're all on good terms, including this guy Richard) and he told us.
We went back inside, rang the solic to check our deeds (we have the same solic as it happens). House number 1 and the 5 houses east have easement it says on both our deeds. So we went back out to tell Richard. He said "yeah but it's unregistered so you snooze you lose. I'm putting a house up and having that 10foot." Me - "my ar5e you are!"
So Rachael rang the council (it's not theirs) and I rang Land Registry. It is indeed unregistered, not showing any owners.
I spent looong hours in the library and did literally weeks of research, chasing names and heirs and their heirs etc back through workhouses and shipping lists and all kinds of other (very interesting!) situations.
The upshot was that it's owned by dozens of people, all of whom either are ignorant of it or don't care. It's fragmented down from the 2 original owners of our road and a few streets round us, who were farmers. Our 10foot didn't get built on so that coal men could get in etc. We all put our bins out there now.
Back on to the solic. "What'll we do now then?" "If you block it off so only you 6 houses have exclusive access for 12 years, you can retrospectively claim it." "Right but what's the difference to how we are now?" "Not a thing." "Aye well we'll not bother then, thanks very much."
So, round to Richard's with the bad news. "The land belongs to these people so you can't have it." He actually laughed and said he knew all that himself but thought he'd try it anyway, cos "I never thought you little women would know how to check it out" !! Me - "You wait til I tell your wife you said that, she'll not have sex with you for the rest of the year for that!"

So there you go. Unregistered does not mean no-one owns it.

I need to learn how to shorten my stories lol

Davesnave

YoungBlueEyes wrote: »

I need to learn how to shorten my stories lol

And explain how you phoned your solicitor on an Easter weekend!