Visiting tradesman -your responsibility?

Doozergirl

Oh my goodness. This, and the reaction of the police, is why you need CCTV. You are allowed to have it to reasonably protect your property. As long as it's not pointing in other people's windows (so you need to consider how to cover as much space - probably at high level on one side pointing down and across the front/side of house so it's just covering your patch).

You need both evidence and deterrent.

It's absolutely not on and harrasssment and vandalism is not a civil matter. I'm not surprised the plumber lamped him one at this point.

AnotherJoe

I would Make a specific complaint about the graffiti to the police. Whatever he said doesn't matter a jot if they take him to court.

moneyistooshorttomention

G_M wrote: »

Report vandalism / criminal damage to the police.

Agreed - and take a photo of it before you have it removed.

moneyistooshorttomention

Tygermoth wrote: »

The police refused to come out citing a 'civil dispute'

I argued that was not the case especially with the knocking and bell ringing when he knows it's not us. They still didn't come out but i did get a call back from one of the ladies as they had called and spoken to him.

Apparently he didn't spray paint my wall.

"It was a random act of kindness from someone how has obviously seen what's been going on with the parking in the lane" he doesn't condone it but can see why they might have done it.

*fuming*

"A random act of kindness" by a stranger - oh really?:cool: I can see those pigs flying past.....

I'd try taking it higher with the police and not give up on getting them to do their job of dealing with it.

I'd second getting cctv at this point - as I wouldnt be surprised if he puts that graffiti up again after you've removed it. Next time - well it might act as a deterrant and, if it doesnt, and he repeats the vandalism = you'll have proof it's him and not some misguided "kind stranger".

bouicca21

If there are no witnesses to the spray painting then it is unlikely to get to court. I'd be more inclined to pursue the harassment angle.

Davesnave

bouicca21 wrote: »

If there are no witnesses to the spray painting then it is unlikely to get to court. I'd be more inclined to pursue the harassment angle.

Agreed, the graffiti pig has flown, but like Arnie, he'll be back, and better evidence-collection re harassment is probably the only way he'll eventually be stopped.

Savvy_Sue

bouicca21 wrote: »

If there are no witnesses to the spray painting then it is unlikely to get to court. I'd be more inclined to pursue the harassment angle.

got the impression neighbour opposite had seen him at it?

david1951

Call crimestoppers on 0800 555 111 and see what they say. They will probably suggest collecting any evidence (your own statement is a form of evidence, as is that of any neighbour, and also a photo of the damage and it's proximity to his house) and formally reporting it to the police. The standard of proof is 'beyond any reasonable doubt'; therefore they may choose not to pursue the case depending on the evidence. You might think this is a clear cut case (it sounds like it), but given the cuts to the CPS and police nothing surprises me anymore.

It is partly a civil dispute - you can sue him for the cost of removing the graffiti. The standard of proof is 'balance of probabilities'. This means that it must be more likely than not that he caused the damage. In this case, he will basically need to stand in front of a judge and either refuse to answer the question, lie, or admit that he caused the damage. I'd say you would quite easily win. Be wary that winning a civil suit against him is not likely to please him (he sounds like the sort of guy that would seek revenge, rather than admit his errors).

Maybe too late for tea and cake, but that's still an option if you think tempers can be controlled.....

TBagpuss

Tygermoth wrote: »

The police refused to come out citing a 'civil dispute'

I argued that was not the case especially with the knocking and bell ringing when he knows it's not us. They still didn't come out but i did get a call back from one of the ladies as they had called and spoken to him.

Apparently he didn't spray paint my wall.

"It was a random act of kindness from someone how has obviously seen what's been going on with the parking in the lane" he doesn't condone it but can see why they might have done it.

*fuming*

I would get back to the police and state that you wish to make a formal report of harassment with a view to charges being pressed. If they try to brush you off, ask to speak to someone of the rank of inspector or above.

From what you describe, his behaviour fits the definition of harassment (it involves a course of conduct amounting to harassment) which is a criminal offence. Make the point that this individual has already assaulted (been accused of assaulting) one person over this issue and that his harassment is escalating.

Log each and every further incident with the police.

it may be worth your while to send him a letter, either written by you (post it, get proof of posting, and keep a copy) or by a solicitor, to state that his coming to your home, ringing your doorbell, or approaching you in the street will be considered to be harassment and will be reported as such, and then any communication is to be in writing only. if you want, you could make the point that you do not park in the lane, that you do, and will continue to, inform your visitors not to do so but that you are not responsible for the actions of anyone other than yourself and will not be able to enter into any discussion about vehicles other than your own.


You could, if you wish, add a separate letter to remind him that the wall is yours and that he is not to paint or fix anything on or two it without your written consent abut that you would be prepared to discuss arrangements for a 'no parking ' sign if he wishes (you could then determine what you were comfortable with, in terms of the size of the sign, how it is attached to your property etc. If it was me, I might want it to be put up by a professional and with a written agreement to make good any damage, but that would depend a bit on the wall - I'm not sure if it is your house wall or a garden wall)

I would also consider a camera for your front door to record his behaviour. With regard to the lane, I'm not sure where you would stand, as any camera would presumably be fixed to your wall but recording the lane / his land - get advice first.

on the original point, I think that the fact that the contractor was employed by your insurers not you direct is a red herring. You are not their employer (and wouldn't be, even if you had instructed them directly). His beef is with the contractor (or the plumbing firm, if the individual is employed)

If your neighbour is behaving in a similar way to other neighbours it may be worth them contacting the police as well, to report harassment / anti-social behaviour.

When you speak to the police, use the term harassment specifically.

armchaireconomist

Do not take the "civil dispute" nonsense. It is harassment and criminal damage, demand they take action. Who knows what he is capable of.