Can my dentist do this? Isn't this discrimination?

MrHeisenberg

LABMAN wrote: »

• ‘must’ is used where the duty is compulsory;
• ‘should’ is used where the duty would not apply
in all situations

Yeah, I think the "should" should apply in most situations and it is hard to see why it wouldn't apply here, unless I have missed something someone can spot?

MrHeisenberg

welshdent wrote: »

where is the official guidance from? because ive never seen it. Seriously. No one has ever presented that to me or any dentists I know in my practice

That's a worry.

MrHeisenberg

brook2jack wrote: »

Welshdent , it!!!8217;s from GDC s latest guidelines https://www.gdc-uk.org/professionals/standards/team

However it is to cover patients who are registered eg Scotland, NI , or on eg private capitation scheme and most particularly patients who are in the middle of a course of treatment.

As we know in England and Wales there is no registration on the NHS and patients have no automatic right to see a particular dentist http://www.itv.com/news/story/2014-08-18/nhs-dental-care-too-hard-to-find/

Lack of Udas , breakdown of relationship etc.

OP appears to have been given an appointment with another dentist and has only ever seen this dentist once.

Since dentistry is predicated on trust it is not in a patients interest to insist on being seen by a dentist who feels the relationship has broken down. Without trust on both sides it is unlikely to give a satisfactory outcome for patient or dentist.

So seeing a dentist via the NHS is hardly comparable to seeing a GP via the NHS? Why have things become so complicated with dentistry?

Yeah, I think the whole trust thing can easily be exploited by an overzealous practitioner who is overly keen to get rid of a patient he/she would rather not have as a patient - just my opinion.

I've haven't been afforded an appointment. I have just been told I've been transferred.

MrHeisenberg

mollycat wrote: »

Have read whole thread

OP, sorry to hear about your pain.

If your mental health difficulties are severe enough to constitute you being considered disabled, do you have a mental health professional providing you with support?

If not, what one would do would be to work with you on coping strategies to manage and alleviate your depressive symptoms in order to protect your mood.

They would promote helpful activity, (distraction, pleasurable activity, relaxation techniques etc, etc)

They would discourage unhelpful activity, (excess alcohol, random compliance with medication, isolating oneself from others etc).

Im pretty sure they would see involving oneself in a 6 page argument with strangers on the internet where there is almost universal disagreement with your viewpoint as unhelpful.

I would get back to doing the helpful stuff.

ps...If you are finding this helpful, feel free to ignore this post.

Thanks for the input.

Yes, I proven to meet the definition a few times before.

I've exhausted all therapies available on the NHS.

The chronic pain is an instant mood killer, as I'm sure you can appreciate. Of course, when I feel like I've been fobbed off unfairly by dentists when seeking help and support this doesn't do wonders for one's mental health. And, yes, having to face the tidal wave of unpleasant remarks on this forum doesn't help either.

mollycat

MrHeisenberg wrote: »

Thanks for the input.

Yes, I proven to meet the definition a few times before.

I've exhausted all therapies available on the NHS.

The chronic pain is an instant mood killer, as I'm sure you can appreciate. Of course, when I feel like I've been fobbed off unfairly by dentists when seeking help and support this doesn't do wonders for one's mental health. And, yes, having to face the tidal wave of unpleasant remarks on this forum doesn't help either.

Let the debate on here go then! No harm will come to you if you simply walk away from this thread

I cant imagine its of any value to you reading the comments here.

You wont persuade others to support the point that youre being discriminated against, (i dont believe you are being either BTW), but it has no bearing on your mental wellbing whether yo achieve that or not.

Process it for what is; a few dozen people you will never know, nor meet, who disagree with you.

Disagreeing with someone does not mean one wishes them ill will!

welshdent

NHS dentistry and NHS medicine are TOTALLY different. It is far too large a topic to go through in a single post. As explained - Wales an England have no registration. You are not registered with a practice and if they have run out of or have allocated their funding already they not only have no obligation to see you, they CAN'T see you!

As Brook alluded to, NI and Scotland are different. They DO have registration and as such there would be policies and protocols in place to terminate a relationship however Wales and England are very different entities.

Dentists did not want this system. It was imposed. Much the same as what happened with the junior doctors but lets just say public sympathy is a lot lower for us tooth fixers.

A practice is allocated an amount of "UDA's" or "units of dental activity" Their funding is based entirely on doing these. We can not get more if we need more unless we pitch for them. If we do less we have claw back of cash.

MrHeisenberg

mollycat wrote: »

Let the debate on here go then! No harm will come to you if you simply walk away from this thread

I cant imagine its of any value to you reading the comments here.

You wont persuade others to support the point that youre being discriminated against, (i dont believe you are being either BTW), but it has no bearing on your mental wellbing whether yo achieve that or not.

Process it for what is; a few dozen people you will never know, nor meet, who disagree with you.

Disagreeing with someone does not mean one wishes them ill will!

There are some people that are genuinely receptive and helpful, but sadly there are a few rotten apples who are incapable of having a debate without resorting to insults and put-downs. Fortunately, I have a thick enough skin not to give those people the time of day.

I'm not sure how you've come to the conclusion you've come to? Perhaps you could explain? I've tried asking the others to do the same but you will note that when asked this question they seem to disappear.

I had a not too dissimilar situation with a consultant a few years ago. I raised a complaint and was coerced into attending a "local resolution meeting" which was audio recorded. At the end of the meeting, the consultant ended the relationship and when I asked him why, he said, in no uncertain terms, this was because I raised a complaint against him.

I then complained to the Trust and they put a different spin on things (presumably after taking legal advice) alleging I had lost trust in him (because I raised a complaint it would seem).

I then raised a complaint with the GMC as his actions are contrary to the guidelines - they wouldn't lift a finger even though his reasons were clear and available for all and sundry to hear.

I then raised the complaint with the Ombudsman who upheld my complaint, forcing the Trust to apologise.

So, in short, I am no stranger to this type of thing and alarm bells are going off here in a deafening fashion. I also have no faith in terms of regulators doing anything, hence the reason I am considering using the courts.

MrHeisenberg

welshdent wrote: »

NHS dentistry and NHS medicine are TOTALLY different. It is far too large a topic to go through in a single post. As explained - Wales an England have no registration. You are not registered with a practice and if they have run out of or have allocated their funding already they not only have no obligation to see you, they CAN'T see you!

As Brook alluded to, NI and Scotland are different. They DO have registration and as such there would be policies and protocols in place to terminate a relationship however Wales and England are very different entities.

Dentists did not want this system. It was imposed. Much the same as what happened with the junior doctors but lets just say public sympathy is a lot lower for us tooth fixers.

A practice is allocated an amount of "UDA's" or "units of dental activity" Their funding is based entirely on doing these. We can not get more if we need more unless we pitch for them. If we do less we have claw back of cash.

Sounds far from ideal. I wonder why there is no universal healthcare system. I'm sure there must be a good reason for the current situation?

mollycat

Okay, Ile give it a go.

Your contend that you are being discriminated against because you are disabled.

If your dental practice is discriminatory against persons who are disabled it would be rejecting other, (or all surely?), disabled people. Do you have any evidence that supports this?

Your dental practice, if it has disabled persons on its caseload, will quite easily be able to prove it does not behave in a discriminatory way.

There will be many possible reasons you have been asked not to return to this practice, I see no evidence in what you have said that supports any predudice towards any group that is protected from discrimination in law.

IMHO,

MrHeisenberg

mollycat wrote: »

Okay, Ile give it a go.

Your contend that you are being discriminated against because you are disabled.

If your dental practice is discriminatory against persons who are disabled it would be rejecting other, (or all surely?), disabled people. Do you have any evidence that supports this?

Your dental practice, if it has disabled persons on its caseload, will quite easily be able to prove it does not behave in a discriminatory way.

There will be many possible reasons you have been asked not to return to this practice, I see no evidence in what you have said that supports any predudice towards any group that is protected from discrimination in law.

IMHO,

Thanks for the explanation.

I think what I would be claiming is a contravention of section 15, which can be found here:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/15

Essentially, this affords disabled people protection from poor treatment as a consequence of anything to do with their disability.

You can read more about it on page 84 here:

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/servicescode_0.pdf

In this case I will argue the dentist sought to end the relationship because i was a difficult/complex patient to care for and manage in terms of my chronic pain and appeared grumpy and withdrawn (as a consequence of my disability).

I would also argue that my depression results in me thinking negatively and causes irritability, giving the impression i am not happy with someone.

I only need to establish a casual link between my disability and the unfavourable treatment. Moreover, the reason for the unfavourable (poor) treatment need not be the main reason but does need to be an effective cause.

So, in short, i will argue i was treated poorly as a result of my disability, albeit in a very casual sense.

I could also argue a contravention of section 19 (indirect discrimination) because a provision, criterion or practice (PCP) required me to appear upbeat and engaging (giving the impression I am happy with the services provided):

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/19

Moreover, I could also argue a failure to make reasonable adjustments (a more understanding approach to my situation):

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/20

So, whether or not other disabled people are treated at the practice is a moot point. Everyone is unique and certain characteristics could cause different responses and outcomes.