NHS Sick leave policy puts you in a no-win situation

ACG

I used to work for a bank, 8 years ago. You are describing the policy they had when it comes to sick pay.

Part of the reason for the return to work is to have a discussion about your circumstances, what can be done to help etc.

elsien

NWOIHTS wrote: »

Although I find going into greater details about any illness with my employer a tad beyond the pale sometimes.

They need to check whether you are fit to return to/carry out your role. How do you expect them to do that without asking questions about your assorted ailments?

You also appear to be saying that if illness is genuine then the procedures shouldn't apply. It doesn't work like that. Your sickness could be perfectly genuine but still unsustainable for the organisation in the long run from a financial point for view and having to arrange cover. And lead to them considering whether you are able to manage the role that you are in. Hence the procedures.

maysmummy

Hi Andrew
I also work for the NHS and 'severe stress' or in fact sickness absence due to any form of stress is an automatic referral to occy health.
There are a number of levels - usually 3 - of absence management and you aren't specific about which level you are on. Have you had your ' first letter of concern'? You should have been provided with a copy of the policy with your first review. As your target is only 20/02/18 - barely more than 3 weeks away , it shouldn't be a massive deal to do this.
You sound very cross about this but , having been down this road myself I'd say 2 things: give a little to get a lot( that is, try and work with your manager rather than seeing it as personal) and do what you can to help yourself i.e. Address any underling issues you may have , be it mental or physical health.
I wish you success

nicechap

Sounds like a perfectly acceptable process is being applied.

Just one point of clarification. Its not a disciplinary if you're off sick (unless faking it), its referred to as managing attendance, so about competency to do the job in the future. Its not a "punishment" but a benefit of working in a supportive organisation - try taking a few separate days off if you're a hod carrier and see how long you remain on site.

t0rt0ise

It's not a benefit of a supporting organisation. It's for the benefit of the organisation so that they can go through the process of getting rid of people who get ill more often than others.

I used to work in the NHS and a woman there had asthma and chest problems and got chest infections. She would always come in to start with so everyone knew she was ill, and then take a couple of days off to get to the GP and get antibiotics. She got disciplined and the result was that she was told not to be ill for the next 9 months. Ridiculous! She failed and left a while later which is probably what the employer really wanted.

I agree with the OP, the whole thing is an inappropriate way to manage staff illness.

Comms69

t0rt0ise wrote: »

It's not a benefit of a supporting organisation. It's for the benefit of the organisation so that they can go through the process of getting rid of people who get ill more often than others.

I used to work in the NHS and a woman there had asthma and chest problems and got chest infections. She would always come in to start with so everyone knew she was ill, and then take a couple of days off to get to the GP and get antibiotics. She got disciplined and the result was that she was told not to be ill for the next 9 months. Ridiculous! She failed and left a while later which is probably what the employer really wanted.

I agree with the OP, the whole thing is an inappropriate way to manage staff illness.

Why is it inappropriate. She wasn't able to do the job....

t0rt0ise

Comms69 wrote: »

Why is it inappropriate. She wasn't able to do the job....

I tell you why.. because if someone who has a few days off every three months or so isn't capable of doing their job, they probably aren't capable of doing any job. But according to the government they will be capable and not allowed to sit at home receiving benefits. Therefore which is it? Are they capable of working or not?

Comms69

To keep it simple, they either find a flexible job, or find a new job every 3-6 months.

It’s not my problem, nor the employers problem, nor frankly the govts problem. It’s HER problem to solve.

NWOIHTS

Quite surprised at some of the comments on here about this. I'm not looking for sympathy, or justifying being off sick. I've worked for night on 25 years in many industries, probably a lot more than most have here, I turned up without exception, very rarely took time off.

There was also a comment about me being off with Severe Stress, and that this just doesn't happen and you recover in one day. Well no it doesn't but I was just coping with it, our manager is a total gestapo, she creates more problems and doesn't seem to understand the workload we have, mainly I would say down to poor management , the whole structure of the NHS is the same, managers patting themselves on the back while shoving all the problems down to the guys on the shop floor. I work in tech, speak to anyone in there and you will get the jist of it.

I got up one morning and was literally being sick through stress that had been culminating over the last few weeks. I did speak to my manager about it and things have settled down a good bit now, no thanks to the senior management, I took matters into my own hands and got things a bit more streamlined with my line manager's help.

My original point was basically how can it be that if you are off say 2 days in Jan with a really bad cold, say June with a sick bug, 5 days in October with a severely sprained ankle, like I had, and 1 day in the next Jan again with a bad cold, then you are triggered as a concern, it's utter madness.

When I worked in other places the manager knew if someone was taking the !!!!, they got on it and the guy either straightened himself out, got a warning, and if didn't improve the manager sacked him.

I tend not to take pain killers or anti-inflammatories, mainly because I don't want to have my body rely on drugs any time I am ill and I just don't like them. Any time I have taken them before I felt worse, woozy, dizzy and felt like sleeping.

With my knee problem you would not have been able to walk even with pain killers, it was absolute agony. I tried to go back before I had fully healed and the result was I had to take more time off as it flared up again. So tell me wouldn't you rather someone got better properly or they rushed back a few days earlier than they really should only to have them off again?

This is the problem, the whole system is geared towards bums on seats, no consideration of actually having people healthy because you need to be healthy and feeling at your best to operate productively, no thought that actually being at work when you are still ill or drugged to the head with cold medicine/pain killers etc. is going to do any good, you could be making lots of mistakes. A big concern for data critical job such as mine.

I'm firmly in the real World but I think these people aren't with their silly policies. I'd actually heard that they were going to be reviewing it, probably because so many people has complained it was targeting people who were genuinely ill through no fault of their own.

Takeaway_Addict

NWOIHTS wrote: »

Quite surprised at some of the comments on here about this. I'm not looking for sympathy, or justifying being off sick. I've worked for night on 25 years in many industries, probably a lot more than most have here, I turned up without exception, very rarely took time off.

There was also a comment about me being off with Severe Stress, and that this just doesn't happen and you recover in one day. Well no it doesn't but I was just coping with it, our manager is a total gestapo, she creates more problems and doesn't seem to understand the workload we have, mainly I would say down to poor management , the whole structure of the NHS is the same, managers patting themselves on the back while shoving all the problems down to the guys on the shop floor. I work in tech, speak to anyone in there and you will get the jist of it.

I got up one morning and was literally being sick through stress that had been culminating over the last few weeks. I did speak to my manager about it and things have settled down a good bit now, no thanks to the senior management, I took matters into my own hands and got things a bit more streamlined with my line manager's help.

My original point was basically how can it be that if you are off say 2 days in Jan with a really bad cold, say June with a sick bug, 5 days in October with a severely sprained ankle, like I had, and 1 day in the next Jan again with a bad cold, then you are triggered as a concern, it's utter madness.

When I worked in other places the manager knew if someone was taking the !!!!, they got on it and the guy either straightened himself out, got a warning, and if didn't improve the manager sacked him.

I tend not to take pain killers or anti-inflammatories, mainly because I don't want to have my body rely on drugs any time I am ill and I just don't like them. Any time I have taken them before I felt worse, woozy, dizzy and felt like sleeping.

With my knee problem you would not have been able to walk even with pain killers, it was absolute agony. I tried to go back before I had fully healed and the result was I had to take more time off as it flared up again. So tell me wouldn't you rather someone got better properly or they rushed back a few days earlier than they really should only to have them off again?

This is the problem, the whole system is geared towards bums on seats, no consideration of actually having people healthy because you need to be healthy and feeling at your best to operate productively, no thought that actually being at work when you are still ill or drugged to the head with cold medicine/pain killers etc. is going to do any good, you could be making lots of mistakes. A big concern for data critical job such as mine.

I'm firmly in the real World but I think these people aren't with their silly policies. I'd actually heard that they were going to be reviewing it, probably because so many people has complained it was targeting people who were genuinely ill through no fault of their own.

Why ask the question if you're just going to rant anyway and not acknowledge the other view?