Selling after lost capacity

AdrianC

You miss the point. This is not about you as an individual. This is about the bank realising that an unauthorised person has access to a vulnerable individual's accounts. That is only going to have one outcome... Blocked access.

lisyloo

I have ZERO access to their money.
Not sure if you are familiar with how on-line savings accounts work but the only way you can withdraw money is to a linked current account. I am purely a typist with their permission.

I think the chance of the bank realising is virtually zero and right now that’s a chance I’m prepared to take.

I have much greater concerns right now with FIL in hospital and a holiday booked next week.

Does anyone know if MIL would get a reduction in the cost of guardianship if the half property she owns is a home? And her income is the minimum under benefits.

martindow

lisyloo wrote: »

My neice (their grandaughter) has formal "3rd party" access to their current account and she pays all the bills. She has a debit card issued and on-line access. FIL has not handled money during his 60 year marriage and neither of them (89 and 90) can operate a computer in fact MIL cannot operate telephone or remote control.

I have informal access to their savings i.e. done with family permission.

By whom? and for what?
I merely carried out a bit of typing for them.

Being named on a joint account is entirely different as you have survivorship rights.
I am not named on any accounts. I have merely written some forms and done some typing. Surely secretaries do this all the time??
I have never signed anything on their behalf or put anything in my name.

The 2 beneficiaries are my husband and his sister.
They are both delighted that I sort out the pension credit, attendance allowance, carers benefit, warm front grant, council tax benefit, nursing home fee assement, home care assesment and I have benefitted them greatly in financial terms by claiming as much as I can.

non-existent risk IMO as I have defrauded nobody and caused no financial losss to anyone.

I wasn't implying that you had any fraudulent intent, merely that there is a potential risk of someone making an accusation. Like you I was only helping out a relative and was acting in their interest.

I find it hard to see how a bank would know the details of what is going on and that freezing the account is vanishingly unlikely. Surely this is only a possibility if it comes to light that someone is stealing from as vulnerable person.

getmore4less

Why is LPA for the FIL taking so long.

If he has capacity then it should be simple form filling process.

AdrianC

getmore4less wrote: »

Why is LPA for the FIL taking so long.

If he has capacity then it should be simple form filling process.

It's far from instant, even once the forms go back.

Out,_Vile_Jelly

OP, it may be worth contacting Age UK for specific advice as I'm sure your situation is not uncommon: https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/money-legal/

lisyloo

merely that there is a potential risk of someone making an accusation

I am aware of this.
In fact we are all aware of this and we all keep records of any cash in and out so there cannot be any misunderstandings.

I'm grateful for all points made but right now priority number 1 is FIL in hospital. Priority number 2 is our holiday next week (in one way not high priority but boarding a long haul flight is a hard deadline and going on a ship for 8 days is another).
Priority number 3 is guardianship for MIL.

Why is LPA for the FIL taking so long.

There is a pause in the process of several weeks to give people time to object. This is the stage we are at right now.

It took us a long time to get the forms done as it was difficult to find people to do the "certification" bit. Being 89 and 90 most of their friends are dead. They have also been housebound for a while (FIL gave up driving at 84) so another loss of friends. GPs refused to do it on the basis they don't know him. We did find some people but they don't live nearby so that took a bit of time. Getting a witness for his signature was difficult. We asked staff at the nursing home just to witness a signature but they wanted permission from a manager (who doesn't work weekends). In the end we left a note for the carer to do it.
So as you see it's not straighforward. We do not live nearby either so when 1 attempt fails it might be a few weeks before we think of something else to try.
But right now it's waiting for objections.
I don't think that's an issue.
Hospital are taking instructions from next of kin anyway.

If he has capacity then it should be simple form filling process.

No it isn't. We've had difficulty getting witnesses who ONLY need to witness a signature let alone people who need to take responsibilities. I expect we will hit the same issue with guardianship.

Witnesses are supposed to SEE you sign and if you never go out ad only see people who don't qualify (relatives) that makes it tricky especially if people refuse.

getmore4less

Since no one needs to know there is an LPA being set up objections are unlikely unless you tell people.

The certificate provider can be the witness just need to get them together once.(certificate provider should visit to confirm capacity)

lisyloo

Since no one needs to know there is an LPA being set up objections are unlikely unless you tell people.

Agreed, but there is specified time period (4 weeks?) when it has to wait.
It isn't us holding it up, that's the process.

Why do you think there is a rush on this? There simply isn't.
If FIL dies it ceased to be valid.

The certificate provider can be the witness just need to get them together once.(certificate provider should visit to confirm capacity)

I was told that we required people who knew him not just anyone.
Also as already stated it was difficult to get witnesses as he is housebound.
The manager of the nursing home wouldn't help. Care home staff would not help. GPs would not help.
So "just" getting a willing person has been difficult.
Not sure why you are disputing the reality of our actual experiences.

I don't live nearby BTW, so if it fails and I'm not visiting for 2 or 3 weeks then it has to wait until the next visit, hence the delays.

We do also have other things to do that cannot be put on hold - like caring for babies, working, our own homes etc. We are a supportive and united family but with 2 very dependent parents it's difficult and we are all doing our best.

getmore4less

Not disputing your situation just pointing out you only need one person that can act as certificate provider and witness(only one needed).

Finding a willing certificate provider can be a problem especially if contact is not recent.