Selling after lost capacity

lisyloo

no, not after she dies

Good points, thanks.

This depends as stated if owned as 'Joint tenants' or 'Tenants in Common'

Will the "title register" for the leasehold show this?
Asking as the specimen on the LR site does not show this.
If not how do I find this?

EDIT: Aparently this means tenants-in-common (I though joint tennats was the norm).

No disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court.

lisyloo

I've checked at LR and it's joint tenants i.e. text above is not present.

If the property is joint tenants and all money is in joint accounts (no investments) then is probate needed?

konark

lisyloo wrote: »

I've checked at LR and it's joint tenants
If the property is joint tenants and all money is in joint accounts (no investments) then is probate needed?

No, but hang on nobody's died yet.

lisyloo

konark wrote: »

No, but hang on nobody's died yet.

Agreed, but having the information gained is useful.
For example I’m in the process of moving their savings to a better rate. Keeping it in a joint savings account means we won’t need probate as all property and cash is jointly held.

I was trying to work out whether it was worth pursuing guardianship as a priority.
As it’s not necessarily required (for example house could pass to FIL) then I think it’s not needed as a priority.

People in nursing homes generally don’t last that long and my MILs symptoms (in particular dimensia plus delirium) mean less than a year is likely.
My husband is preparing to lose her mentally i.e. she won’t know who he is.

I think financial, legal (for example) POA and emotional preparation is a good idea.
We are not angling for an inheritance as we know it may go in care fees.

She has DNR and we were told he wouldn’t even be a “candidate for resuscitation”.
I’m sorry if you find it a bit difficult and matter of fact but I am only trying to support the family. If the doctors say he’s plainly not a candidate for resuscitation then perhaps it gives you an idea of how close they are. Both have very little quality of life, MIL has zero independence, cant see well, hear well, read or walk very well. FIL is depressed and in pain, embarrassed by his condition and wants it to end.

Perhaps this is partly my way of coping?

SIL is calling 111 as carer says FIL is unresponsive.

macman

I don't understand your obsession with saving on council tax. The cost of going to the Court of Protection will vastly exceed a year or so of CT, even at full rate.
If all the assets are in joint names then no probate is necessary, as the entire estate passes to the surviving party. But if the sole assets exceed £15K, then it probably is.

lisyloo

I don't understand your obsession with saving on council tax.

That makes 2 of us :-)
I was rather confused when you said CT in post #2.

Q2 refers to a reduction in the cost of guardianship. Apologies again for any lack of clarity on my part and many thanks for your help.
If she is on minimum income (which for a single person is £159.35 per week) and assuming (note this is an assumption) that her half of the flat is disregarded (because it's currently being used as a home), then would it be cheaper to get guardianship right now?

FIL went into hospital last night and is awaiting a CT scan.

I don't think my husband and his sister would be in a position to do it right now as she has been at his bedside all night, but it might be something we want to consider prioritising if he gets better. The "con" is that if she dies first it's not required and would have been a waste of time and money. Note we had a hard time trying to find certificate providers for the LPA. GPs refused and they have outlived most of the people that knew them and could speak for them, hence it could take some time to get it done.

If all the assets are in joint names then no probate is necessary, as the entire estate passes to the surviving party.

Flat is held jointly. Current account and savings account are in joint accounts, so looks to me like no probate on first death.

martindow

My father was in similar circumstance with dementia. From what you say about moving savings it seems that you have some sort of informal access to the bank accounts.

I found that because I had a joint account with my father, when I set up internet banking all of his accounts were accessible as well.

There is a risk that you could be accused of fraudulent intent I suppose but it was a practical way of settling his bills and arranging things for his benefit with the least hassle.

lisyloo

From what you say about moving savings it seems that you have some sort of informal access to the bank accounts.

My neice (their grandaughter) has formal "3rd party" access to their current account and she pays all the bills. She has a debit card issued and on-line access. FIL has not handled money during his 60 year marriage and neither of them (89 and 90) can operate a computer in fact MIL cannot operate telephone or remote control.

I have informal access to their savings i.e. done with family permission.

There is a risk that you could be accused of fraudulent intent

By whom? and for what?
I merely carried out a bit of typing for them.

Being named on a joint account is entirely different as you have survivorship rights.
I am not named on any accounts. I have merely written some forms and done some typing. Surely secretaries do this all the time??
I have never signed anything on their behalf or put anything in my name.

The 2 beneficiaries are my husband and his sister.
They are both delighted that I sort out the pension credit, attendance allowance, carers benefit, warm front grant, council tax benefit, nursing home fee assement, home care assesment and I have benefitted them greatly in financial terms by claiming as much as I can.

non-existent risk IMO as I have defrauded nobody and caused no financial losss to anyone.

AdrianC

lisyloo wrote: »

My neice (their grandaughter) has formal "3rd party" access to their current account and she pays all the bills. She has a debit card issued and on-line access.

That's perfectly legit.

I have informal access to their savings i.e. done with family permission.

But that could become a big problem. It's really no different to your teenage kid knowing where your PIN and where you keep your debit card...

lisyloo

Except I’m not a teenager I’m a mature adult who’s in a happy 20 year marriage AND has MUCH more money of my own.
I have had about 10 years to steal the money if I wanted.

You may think it’s a risk but you don’t know me/us.

The main risk I’m worried about at the moment is FILs health and unless he improves the risk of falling in his home and after that the holiday I’m supposed to be going on next week. These are far more realistic things to be worried about than me finding a toy boy and running off with their money (which I KNOW is not going to happen).

I know some people might find it hard to believe but there IS such a thing as moral certainty.