Help and advice please :-Been taken to county court for £15 ! yes £15

[Deleted User]

You were sent messages and you would have received email notifications to reflect that.

That's the same principal as sending a letter in the post and you ignoring it.

Pay the bill and learn for next time

ciderboy2009

OP - have you actually paid the seller back the £15 you're not disputing?

If not then why not? Most people would have paid it immediately on discovering that they owed it.

District Judges in County Courts are normally fairly lenient about the lack of a letter before action if the clamant can show that they were trying to make contact in other ways but not getting a response. Particularly if it looks like the defendant was still delaying payment after they were made aware of the debt.

PixelPound

I would think that the OP hasn't paid since he got an email saying the seller would not accept payment by paypal now. That the OP has several ebay accounts including business ones it does seem different from the initial statements of getting the order cancelled and not aware of all the emails since. If the OP had not received any refund, like the £8 he was supposed to have got - would he not have noticed the missing refund?

There are two aspects of this been discussed. The morality of paying for what you have got, including returning an unexpected refund; and the ability to be protected from unfair CCJ claims by ensuring correct procedure has been followed.

iammumtoone

As I understand it court papers HAVE to be issued by post (email delivery is not acceptable)

I believe this is so the defendant cannot claim they did not received them (internet was down, forgot password to emails etc)

So why does a letter not have to be sent to give the defendant chance to sort before court.

I feel for the OP. I do not check my bank statements to that detail with the small amount involved (large amounts I would check thoroughly). I also do not check ebay every day only if I need to. My ebay/paypal emails go to an email address that is mine but not my main one again this does not get checked regularly (too much spam received from paypal/ebay for it to be set up in my daily check email box).


For those in the know the OP has offered to pay the debt owed but the claimant has refused to accept this, how will this go down in court? Do the court take into account the fact a claimant has the right to now demand their additional costs or do courts just deal with the original amount owed that the defendant has offered to pay before the court stage.

sourcrates

Lots of people saying "why didn't you just pay it", well when i was active on eBay, i went long periods without logging on, or checking my emails, as i have a life, sellers tend to get jittery if you don't respond straight away, not everyone is connected 24-7 though, cut him some slack here.

OP, if this guy has issued a claim, you can pay it on receipt of the claim, preferably by a method you can prove, and that will be the end of the matter.

Yes you will have to pay the fee. Your only other option is to play him at his own game, only part admit the claim, and counterclaim for what he owes you.

I recon with such a tiny amount of money involved, the judge may well throw the case out, especially as he didn't comply with pre-action protocols, as he is meant to :

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/pdf/protocols/pre-action-protocol-for-debt-claims.pdf


1.1. This Protocol applies to any business (including sole traders and public bodies) claiming payment of a debt from an individual (including a sole trader). The business will be referred to as the “creditor” and the individual will be referred to as the “debtor”. This Protocol does not apply to business-to- business debts unless the debtor is a sole trader.

justwondering25 wrote: »

But the seller is a registered VAT business, I am a individual, I am also a sole trader, the items where for use in my business.

PixelPound

iammumtoone wrote: »

As I understand it court papers HAVE to be issued by post (email delivery is not acceptable)

I believe this is so the defendant cannot claim they did not received them (internet was down, forgot password to emails etc)

So why does a letter not have to be sent to give the defendant chance to sort before court.

Some posters have suggested as its an individual and not a company that it doesn't, but the OP disagrees. The whole point of change in the pre-CCJ is to ensure dispute resolution has been attempted, and it does state sending a letter and giving 30 day to respond, which hasn't happened.

I feel for the OP. I do not check my bank statements to that detail with the small amount involved (large amounts I would check thoroughly). I also do not check ebay every day only if I need to. My ebay/paypal emails go to an email address that is mine but not my main one again this does not get checked regularly (too much spam received from paypal/ebay for it to be set up in my daily check email box).

But if you had made a sale/purchase would you check then?

For those in the know the OP has offered to pay the debt owed but the claimant has refused to accept this, how will this go down in court? Do the court take into account the fact a claimant has the right to now demand their additional costs or do courts just deal with the original amount owed that the defendant has offered to pay before the court stage.

It depends at what point. If the claimant had already started the claim and so incurred fees then they can simply refuse to take just the £15 if the defendant was not wanting to also pay costs incurred for the claimant to stop further action

chattychappy

In my experience a judge would never "throw the case out" because of a failure to follow pre-action protocol. More likely they will stay the case, giving directions or ultimately award costs against the non-compliant party (even if they win).

I would write and attempt to pay the claimant the £15 asap. If, despite that, the claim form arrives, then the OP is free to part-admit/part-defend. The claimant is then free to decide whether to continue to a hearing just on the question of who pays the claim fee (and by then the hearing fee too). Seems to me that after serving/filing the part-defence, the sensible route would be for the OP to offer to go halves on the claim fee or agree a donation to charity in the same amount or whatever. Nobody wants to waste time on such trivial amounts and in the end these things come down to stubbornness, losing face etc.

Samsung_Note2

Arleen wrote: »

Will take note of that if you ever come here for advice, because you must be perfect to never make a mistake in your life.

Difference is Arleen id have said to myself oh well what a wally i've refunded the wrong amount and learnt by it.

Just before christmas i gave the girl on the market £10 note for fruit,when i should have given her a £5 note,wasn't until id started to walk off and realised id given to much,looking back and the stall is swamped with people...so just sucked it up,my fault for not checking.

Situation is the same here...seller refunded the wrong item so live and learn.

PixelPound

Samsung_Note2 wrote: »

Difference is Arleen id have said to myself oh well what a wally i've refunded the wrong amount and learnt by it.

Just before christmas i gave the girl on the market £10 note for fruit,when i should have given her a £5 note,wasn't until id started to walk off and realised id given to much,looking back and the stall is swamped with people...so just sucked it up,my fault for not checking.

Situation is the same here...seller refunded the wrong item so live and learn.

True, there is the argument the the OP did pay for it but the seller refunded it. Is there ebay T&C that states wrongful refunds must be returned, like on DDG. It also could be argued that its a form of money laundering - deliberate over paying and wanting the "accidental" overpayment returned. Mayne they do it with all buyers :rotfl:

ScaredWitless

Did the ebayer send you a letter before action?

If they did not they are breaking Court protocol.

Please read the link below.

There is guideliness a claimant must follow before initiating Court proceedings.

Please read as this wil be useful to you when setting out your defense.

I would also complain directly to the Court that the Claimant had failed to follow correct procedure ie failed to send you a letter before action.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/355594/pre-action-protocol-for-debt-claims-draft.pdf