Leaseheld space & Double ticket

BarraDisciple

Thanks a lot @Eljayjay2

I'm still perplexed as to how that counts as what they sent me counts as a LBC?

Do you reckon it will be fine to send this by email? I really don't want to spend any money more than I've spent energy on this to be honest (doesn't mean I will hold back, of course)

I tried emailing them in the past as was suggested to me in this thread, but to no avail.

Thanks

Grimble

Post it first class with proof of posting from post office, you can show a judge proof of posting. Deemed delivered two days after posting, there is nothing to prove an email was delivered in law.

Coupon-mad

I received a text message from Gladstones (how the hell do they have my number???)

Are you sure it's from Gladstones and not just DRP playing at being Gladstones again.

BarraDisciple

Actually, you have a point. It's one of those numberless text messages with the sender's name only and it states GLADSTONES. No number though so no way for me to verify!

[Deleted User]

If you have a reliable email address for them, by all means send it by email.

BarraDisciple

Just a quick update guys, the LBCC was in my post today so they sent the text message as soon as they sent the letter.

I will draft a reply to Gallstones and will post it here to get some feedback.

Thanks for your help so far!

Coupon-mad

They stalked you on social media then, or they did a 'soft' credit search and found a phone number attached by your bank or someone, to your credit record.

BarraDisciple

Coupon-mad wrote: »

They stalked you on social media then, or they did a 'soft' credit search and found a phone number attached by your bank or someone, to your credit record.

Reckon I can mention this in the reply or even in the defence?

Coupon-mad

Yes, why not?

Shows predatory tactics and no regard for data protection principles.

It's a solicitor intruding on the privacy of the phone-holder during the pre-action phase, and dangerously assuming the phone user is one and the same as the Defendant (could be a phone you pay the bill for, but belongs to your child!).

Anyone in your household, potentially, could have picked up your phone. A partner could have read that.

Putting pressure on the family...causing embarrassment - it's like a debt collector posting a letter with DEBT in red letters, visible through the window envelope. Intimidation.

[Deleted User]

Below is a draft reply to the letter of claim.




Take the opportunity given to you by the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims to ask for information and documents only. Do not volunteer any information at this stage. Save anything that you might like to add (e.g. comments about the text message) for what comes later, i.e. your defence and your witness statement.


If you have not read the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims from beginning to end, do so. You can google it and click on the justice.gov.uk entry to access it. Section 3 INITIAL INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED BY THE CREDITOR lists what the letter of claim should contain. You need to identify the information and documents missing from the letter of claim so that you can add something into <list here everything which you have found to be missing>.


Do remember that, when sending letters to parking companies and their solicitors, you should use first-class mail, hand over the envelope at a Post Office counter, and request a free certificate of posting.


Dear <salutation>,


Thank you for your letter of claim reference <their ref> dated <date of letter of claim>.


This letter serves two purposes: it is a formal response to the letter of claim; and it is a complaint about your behaviour not only by failing to provide a letter of claim which complies with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims.


Information and documents that should have been provided (but which you have failed to provide) in accordance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims are as follows:-


<list here everything which you have found to be missing>


I shall be grateful if you will explain why you have failed to provide the documents and information mentioned above and, of course, provide them now.


I shall also be grateful if you will explain why you failed to “enclose a copy of the Information Sheet and the Reply Form at Annex 1 to this Protocol” as required in paragraph 3.1(c). <editing will be required if they have provided either of those.>


If you had supplied the requisite reply form, I would have ticked Box D and I would have stated that I still dispute the debt because, despite my previous representations, I have not received an adequate explanation as to why your client believes it has a right to any parking charge from me. In addition, I would have ticked Box I and would have stated that I need more documents or information in order to assess the validity or otherwise of your client’s claim.


The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims does, of course, provide this further opportunity to narrow the issues between your client and myself following the issue of the letter of claim. Accordingly, I take that opportunity by requesting now the documents and information described below:-


I shall also be grateful if you will explain why you failed to send me “a copy of the Information Sheet and the Reply Form at Annex 1 to this Protocol” as required in paragraph 3.1(c).


If you had supplied the requisite reply form, I would have ticked Box D and I would have stated that I still dispute the debt because, despite my previous representations, I have not received an adequate explanation as to why your client believes it has a right to any parking charge from me. In addition, I would have ticked Box I and would have stated that I need more documents or information in order to assess the validity or otherwise of your client’s claim.


The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims does, of course, provide this further opportunity to narrow the issues between your client and myself following the issue of the letter of claim. Accordingly, I take that opportunity by requesting now the documents and information described below:-


1. evidence of ownership of the land;


2. the parking contract between your client and the owner or occupier of the land purporting to grant the right to your client to charge for parking on the land;


3. if the land is owned and/or occupied by a company and the parking contract has not been signed by a director of the company (readily identifiable as such by reference to the company’s records at Companies House), corroborative evidence from a director of the company (who is readily identifiable as such by reference to the company’s records at Companies House) that the signatory has been authorised to enter into the parking contract on behalf of the owner or occupier of the land;


4. if the land is owned and/or occupied by a company, corroborative evidence from a director of the company (who is readily identifiable as such by reference to the company’s records at Companies House) that the site plan is a true and accurate representation of the land which your client purports is the subject of the parking contract;


5. the accredited trade association’s code of practice to which your client claims to adhere;


6. a copy of the site plan provided by your client to its accredited trade association;


7. a copy of the written contract for the alleged debt;


8. notes giving details of the due diligence process undertaken by your client to ensure that not only the contract between your client and its principal but also the purported contract between your client and the driver met the “Implied term about care and skill” requirement contained in the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 and the “Service to be performed with reasonable care and skill” requirement contained in the Consumer Rights Act 2015.


9. if your client applied due diligence, you will know that my parking on the land is governed by a lease which is of paramount importance and has primacy over any contract made by any of its parties with a stranger (such as your client) to the lease;


10. if your client believes that my lease contains express provision to allow your client to operate a parking scheme on the land, a note of the specific clauses in the lease applicable to this situation;


11. if your client believes that any rules or regulations have been made in accordance with my lease’s provisions to allow your client to operate a parking scheme on the allocated parking space:-


a. a copy of those rules or regulations duly signed, etc. by the person(s) who made them; and


b. a note of the specific clause(s) in the lease in accordance with which those rules or regulations were made;


12. as my lease granted a right to park on the land to me as the lessee, a copy of the instrument which either transferred those rights from me to the your client or transferred a share of those rights from me to the your client;


13. if your client believes that my lease’s terms permit third parties, e.g. your client, to enforce the lease’s terms in accordance with the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999, a note of the specific clause(s) in the lease applicable to this situation;


14. if your client does not believe that my lease’s terms permit third parties, e.g. your client, to enforce the lease’s terms in accordance with the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999, a note explaining how your client has concluded that the it has acquired such a right;


15. if your client’s parking scheme has not been introduced in accordance with my lease’s provisions, a note explaining how your client has concluded that its parking contract with the owner or occupier of the land and the your client’s alleged parking contract(s) with driver(s) parking on the land have acquired primacy of contract over my lease;


16. a note giving your client's explanation as to how the current ticketing and charging regime accords with the legal principle of non-derogation from grant implied in all leases;


17. a note giving your client’s explanation as to how the current parking regime with its exorbitant parking charges and threats of court action against lessees using their own allocated parking spaces accords with the legal principle of quiet enjoyment implied in all leases;


18. a transcript of any previous judgement or judgments in any case or cases involving the same land and your client;


19. any other information and documents on which your client would rely in court in support of its belief that the current parking regime is valid.


As you are no doubt aware, paragraph 5 of the Protocol reads as follows:-


5 DISCLOSURE OF DOCUMENTS


5.1 Early disclosure of documents and relevant information can help to clarify or resolve any issues in dispute. Where any aspect of the debt is disputed (including the amount, interest, charges, time for payment, or the creditor’s compliance with relevant statutes and regulations), the parties should exchange information and disclose documents sufficient to enable them to understand each other’s position.


5.2 If the debtor requests a document or information, the creditor must –


(a) provide the document or information; or


(b) explain why the document or information is unavailable,


within 30 days of receipt of the request.


Naturally, I fully expect your client (or your firm on its behalf) to meet the requirements mentioned paragraph 5.2 above.


I do, therefore. look forward to receiving either the documents and information which I have requested or your explanation why they are unavailable within the deadline set by the Protocol.


Yours…