Boiler Insurance

Alex1983

The boiler has had it then, get a second opinion if it you want to be sure, but it’s probably the end for it.

A gas fire needs ventilation if it’s over 7kw. If it’s a decorative flame effect fire, DFE then it will require 100cm2 vents for each if they are in separate rooms, are they in a through room because you’ll need more if they are. Check the manufacturer instructions for the fires requirements, if these are not available we revert back to the method above.

If we are at risking an appliance we have to ask your permission to turn it off, if we turn it off we have to do it in a way that you can turn it back on if you wish. If the gas fire is not lit then that satisfies that we have turned it off.

If you refuse permission to look and check it, if the engineer has a concern they can call the nation grid who have the power to cut you off in the road if you still refuse. Why wouldn’t you want it checked for safety, even more so now your boiler is off and you’d be using them a lot more.

Alex1983

Regards to the last comment on the isar, it’s ID immediately dangerous, if you refuse to allow it to be cut off then the engineer would contact the national grid and they will cut you off in the road.

TinyF

Thanks, again, Alex.

The engineer did mention about the authority of the National Grid but I still didn't agree to him isolating the boiler. I also didn't say he couldn't isolate the boiler so he's made an assumption that I'd prefer him to. Perhaps I should have said let the National Grid do it so that I could have got a second opinion.

He didn't say I could still use the fires and if I hadn't mentioned that we had them he would never have known. We have used them a few times every year for the past 31 years and to expect people to retrospectively fit vents when none were required when the fires were fitted is ridiculous.

Do you know when this legislation was introduced?

Alex1983

National grid are not qualified to work on boilers so they would not give you a second opinion they would just ask permission to cap at the meter and if you refuse they will cut you off in the road and charge you to reconnect when you’ve calmed down and realised you made a bad decision. You don’t want to go down that road, he’s done best for you by just capping the boiler.

He’s at risked your fires, read the letter he left and it will explain he feels it’s unsafe and has advised you to not use it, he can’t stop you from using it, I wouldn’t recommend it without getting them serviced and checked first.

I don’t know when the regs came in, I’ve worked in the gas industry for 15yrs and it’s always been there. I would imagine it’s always been like it. The ventilation requirements are in boiler installation instructions for boilers that are 40yrs old. If you can see the fire make and models it will tell you the requirements in the instructions.

TinyF

Thanks, Alex.

So, are you saying that the ventilation requirements you're talking about don't specifically apply to gas fires, just boilers?

He didn't leave a letter as such and the notice regarding the fires states-

"fault found that poses a possible future risk".

The 'fault' being the lack of a vent in the wall and it's only 'possible' and 'future'.

I can't see the fires' makes and models and as they're 31 years old at least I doubt that I'll find instructions even if I did know the details.

I've sent an email to the Gas Safe Register via their website to ask for clarification on the ventilation issue but it can take up to 5 days for a reply.

I'm freezing, my chest is already playing up. I'm putting a fire on.

Thanks again.

Alex1983

Ventilation is required for all gas appliance, modern boilers are room sealed and don’t normally need any. Old boilers and nearly all fires are open flued and require ventilation.

If there are no markings or anything to identify the fire, it should have a data badge to say the make model and kw output then you can’t work out the ventilation requirements so any gas safe engineer will leave it at risk and advise to not use, you will not get over that without the information for the fires.

The notice saying MAY cause a problem is a standard at risk notice, it will differ from the boiler notice which would say WILL cause a problem.

TinyF

Alex,

I've had a reply from the Gas Safe Register people and they say that ventilation requirements for gas fires is retrospective as it is a safety issue.

It still seems that too much is expected of people and there must be millions in my position using fires that are never seen by gas engineers.

Once I've had a new boiler installed I'll be removing the gas fires completely as I don't intend having two vents in my walls.

Incidentally, the notice states that it is the Gas Emergency Service Provider who has the power to enter the property and disconnect.

Alex1983

Every gas appliance should be checked every year, but your right lots of people don’t.

Most modern fires are rated under 7kw as it means they don’t require any additional ventilation.

TinyF

Alex1983 wrote: »

Every gas appliance should be checked every year, but your right lots of people don’t.

Most modern fires are rated under 7kw as it means they don’t require any additional ventilation.

Thanks for that last piece of info, Alex. I might take a look at more modern gas fires.

malky39

TinyF wrote: »

Thanks for that last piece of info, Alex. I might take a look at more modern gas fires.

Or you could get the ventilation sorted, if that was the issue, will probably be alot cheaper than 2 new fires