When is a first time buyer not a first time buyer?

davidmcn

SB85 wrote: »

Is it any different if you are on a mortgage for a business that has living accommodation i.e. a hotel? Are you still a first time buyer of a home!?

Think so - it relates only to your interest in dwellings, so commercial property ownership is irrelevant.

Rich2808

It should be called a first time home owner incentive.

You can own a home but never have bought one - as you can inherit a home and would thus be ineligible for the stamp duty relief.

This of course relies on the honesty of the applicant - if you inherited a 10 per cent share of your granny's £150 flat in Bucharest in 1985 and sold that interest immediately there may not be any record of that with the Romanian land registry equivalent and HMRC would never be able to prove otherwise.

Oddly if you buy with a partner who has owned before you can benefit from the help to buy ISA bonus incentive for first time buyers but not the stamp duty relief for first time buyers even at a 50 per cent discount. So many definitions and rules - but I presume it means lawyers/conveyancers can make more money interpreting and implementing them.

00ec25

Obigibo wrote: »

So it would seem I do not qualify as a First time buyer, even though this is the First Time I’m Buying. Thanks government!
However, I am purchasing the property with my wife, 50/50, and she has never owned any portion of a property - so can her half of the purchase be exempt from stamp duty?

read the legislation before venting

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/661612/8274_Relief_for_first_time_buyers.pdf.

“First-time buyer”
6 (1) In this Schedule “first-time buyer” means an individual who—
(a) has not previously been a purchaser in relation to a land transaction the main subject-matter of which was a major interest in a dwelling,
(b) has not previously acquired an equivalent interest in a dwelling situated in a country or territory outside England, Wales and Northern Ireland,
(c) has not previously been, or been one of the persons who was, “the person” for the purposes of section 71A or 73 in a case where the main subject-matter of the first transaction within the meaning of the section concerned was a major interest in a dwelling, and
(d) would not have been such a person for those purposes in such a case if the provisions mentioned in paragraph (c) had been in force, and had had effect in the country or territory concerned at all material times (subject, where required, to appropriate modifications).

Rich2808

00ec25 wrote: »

read the legislation before venting

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/661612/8274_Relief_for_first_time_buyers.pdf.

“First-time buyer”
6 (1) In this Schedule “first-time buyer” means an individual who—
(a) has not previously been a purchaser in relation to a land transaction the main subject-matter of which was a major interest in a dwelling,
(b) has not previously acquired an equivalent interest in a dwelling situated in a country or territory outside England, Wales and Northern Ireland,
(c) has not previously been, or been one of the persons who was, “the person” for the purposes of section 71A or 73 in a case where the main subject-matter of the first transaction within the meaning of the section concerned was a major interest in a dwelling, and
(d) would not have been such a person for those purposes in such a case if the provisions mentioned in paragraph (c) had been in force, and had had effect in the country or territory concerned at all material times (subject, where required, to appropriate modifications).

Those are the regulations which would become the law if unchanged. They refer to anyone who has previously purchased a property in England, Wales and NI or acquired an interest (broader than purchasing as this would presumably include inheriting) on an equivalent basis in Scotland or the rest of the world as being ineligible for the relief.

The guidance issued separately excludes people who have inherited property but the above wording refers to purchasing (at least if that property was in 3 of the 4 nations of the UK). Is purchasing and ‘acquiring an interest’ the same thing or different?

Confused – even the government seem to be as their guidance and the actual regulations aren’t wholly consistent at first glance.

Couples/people buying jointly are also ineligible where one has previously purchased (or inherited?) a residential property but the other is a first time buyer/owner – unlike the help to buy isa where the latter would get the FTB bonus even if buying jointly with someone who has owned before.

And if you want to buy in Wales – get your skates on as it wont apply there for purchases after 31 March unless the Welsh government does its own equivalent. It will apply in NI – one benefit of them not having a government to take on more powers - but not Scotland where SDLT is devolved already.

00ec25

Rich2808 wrote: »

Those are the regulations which would become the law if unchanged. They refer to anyone who has previously purchased a property in England, Wales and NI or acquired an interest (broader than purchasing as this would presumably include inheriting) on an equivalent basis in Scotland or the rest of the world as being ineligible for the relief.

The guidance issued separately excludes people who have inherited property but the above wording refers to purchasing (at least if that property was in 3 of the 4 nations of the UK). Is purchasing and ‘acquiring an interest’ the same thing or different?

Confused – even the government seem to be as their guidance and the actual regulations aren’t wholly consistent at first glance.

Couples/people buying jointly are also ineligible where one has previously purchased (or inherited?) a residential property but the other is a first time buyer/owner – unlike the help to buy isa where the latter would get the FTB bonus even if buying jointly with someone who has owned before.

And if you want to buy in Wales – get your skates on as it wont apply there for purchases after 31 March unless the Welsh government does its own equivalent. It will apply in NI – one benefit of them not having a government to take on more powers - but not Scotland where SDLT is devolved already.

please post your links so we can all advance our understanding - subject of course as you rightly point out, drafts and announcements on budget day are merely statements of principle, the details come later and may pick up many scenarios which the principle does not obviously address

Rich2808

00ec25 wrote: »

please post your links so we can all advance our understanding - subject of course as you rightly point out, drafts and announcements on budget day are merely statements of principle, the details come later and may pick up many scenarios which the principle does not obviously address

The guidance note - here - provides a useful Q&A at the back.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/stamp-duty-land-tax-relief-for-first-time-buyers-guidance-note

The regulations are here (as linked above).

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/stamp-duty-land-tax-relief-for-first-time-buyers

The regulations reference purchasing as property before as ruling you out - but the guidance however includes those who inherited properties but never bought one as being ineligible.

As I said - it should be called a first time owner relief - not a first time buyer. You can inherit a home and own one - despite never having purchased one.

Former_MSE_Andrea

Hi everyone

Our news story from budget day should help if you're unsure.

Autumn Budget 2017: Stamp duty axed for most first-time buyers

Andrea