Duff electrical work done on my house

moneyistooshorttomention

I had loads of electrical work done on this house when I bought it a few years ago. I specified things like replacing fusebox with consumer unit, loads of new sockets, etc, etc. Basically "get this house right/modern/safe" and, in hindsight I guess I should have used the exact word "rewiring" and put that word in writing - but this was clearly what I obviously meant.

In my defence:o I had just moved here and "fings is very different" to what I'm used to etc and I was having tradespeople gut the entire house and "get it right/modern/etc".

Several electrical problems later - and I got in a different electrician (as recommended on here - from the Heroes Scheme). He's going through the place checking everything and commenting on things like "no earth to a socket" and pointing out to me that the wiring to some of the "original location" sockets is still the old wiring and explaining about different colours of wiring for different eras.

This is all proving a longer and more expensive job than it should be - for a house that's supposed to be "done/finished and to proper standard...not bodge":mad: - and I've had all my replastering and redecorating done throughout now.

1. Does a cooker hood (ie in my new kitchen) need to have an isolator switch? We can't find one. The consumer unit is very nearby to the kitchen (ie a few feet away) and I know to just go and throw the main switch on it if there's a problem.

2. Does it matter if some of the wiring to sockets is still old:mad:. New electrician has pointed out on a couple of the sockets that a bit of said old wiring is a bit greasy/slippy looking and says it shouldnt be and says it's a sign this wiring has nearly "had it".

3. I don't think I have to ask whether it matters if a socket is missing an earth wire. I'll take his word for it that it matters:eek:

4. Anything else I should think of re this?

New electrician is having to come back again - as this has all proven more complicated than we thought:mad:

Ectophile

1. So long as there is a means to isolate it for servicing, then it's acceptable. If the consumer unit is only a few feet away, then you could just flip the appropriate breaker. But is it appropriately fused down if it's on a high-power circuit such a ring main or cooker circuit?

2. If it's PVC wiring, which is anything since the early 60's, then it will last pretty much forever unless it's overheated or chewed by vermin. Many houses will now have mixtures of old and new colour wiring. Exceptions are aluminium wiring which is best disposed of, or wiring that's leaking green goo because the manufacturer overdid it with the plasticiser.

3. That's just wrong and needs fixing immediately.

4. It sounds like it's one of those "rewires" done on the cheap. Swap the consumer unit and all the accessories, but re-using much of the old wiring. If done properly, it does not have to be dangerous or wrong. If it's just a bodge, then the house may need a proper EICR (electrical installation condition report) to work out where the problems are.

FreeBear

Ectophile wrote: »

1. So long as there is a means to isolate it for servicing, then it's acceptable. If the consumer unit is only a few feet away, then you could just flip the appropriate breaker. But is it appropriately fused down if it's on a high-power circuit such a ring main or cooker circuit?

If the cooker hood is hard wired in, it should be wired up through a suitable Fused Connection Unit - Depending on the manufacturer's specifications, a 3A fuse would typically be fitted.

Wiring a cooker hood directly to the oven/cooker circuit is not acceptable without that (typical) 3A fuse. It is possible that someone has installed a socket inside a cupboard or behind some ducting - This would just about be acceptable as long as the plug can be accessed without difficulty.

moneyistooshorttomention

Ectophile wrote: »

1. So long as there is a means to isolate it for servicing, then it's acceptable. If the consumer unit is only a few feet away, then you could just flip the appropriate breaker. But is it appropriately fused down if it's on a high-power circuit such a ring main or cooker circuit?

2. If it's PVC wiring, which is anything since the early 60's, then it will last pretty much forever unless it's overheated or chewed by vermin. Many houses will now have mixtures of old and new colour wiring. Exceptions are aluminium wiring which is best disposed of, or wiring that's leaking green goo because the manufacturer overdid it with the plasticiser.

3. That's just wrong and needs fixing immediately.

4. It sounds like it's one of those "rewires" done on the cheap. Swap the consumer unit and all the accessories, but re-using much of the old wiring. If done properly, it does not have to be dangerous or wrong. If it's just a bodge, then the house may need a proper EICR (electrical installation condition report) to work out where the problems are.

1. I dont know what you mean by your question in this point?

2. The inch or so stretch of one of those old wires on a couple of these sockets had this current electrician asking me if I'd spilt any oil on them is the best way I can phrase it. Not sure if that would be what you call "leaking green goo"? Sorta slightly shiny-ish and yes it does look like I've got out my pastry brush and brushed that inch or so of the wire with a bit of oil (no I wouldnt be so daft!)

3. It does sound like the first electrician has done a bit of a bodge. It is an area where houses don't seem to get as much maintenance and modernising as the area I've come from and many of them are lower standard than I'm used to - but I would have thought many of the tradespeople here would realise my own standards are more likely to be "get it done properly" level and, if it costs me more, - but I'll pay it....

4. I'm in process of paying this new electrician to do a proper EICR report now. The inspection is taking him longer than either of us thought it would - and he's coming back to finish it off. Part of me is feeling gobsmacked that a house I thought I'd had rewired (and is now supposed to have had all the work of various descriptions completely finished on it) could apparently not be....

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Right now - I'm feeling distinctly concerned hoping he doesnt want to start chasing down walls to put new wires in - with having had the whole house replastered and redecorated since the first one was in and recently had an expensive-to-me new kitchen put in (and the kitchen is where he has been pointing out a couple of these power points with wiring he doesnt like). With it being a new kitchen - it's basically literally impossible to get at much of the walls now (as I've got new units or my expensive new quartz splashbacks on them). Boy have I got my fingers crossed hard - when he explained to me that wiring "should" go down the walls to the powerpoints and he "should" be able to just pull the old wires up from above and then slot new wires down. (The one blessing here being this is a bungalow - so it's my loft immediately above all my rooms). He said he often finds houses here have their wiring in places it shouldnt be.

moneyistooshorttomention

FreeBear wrote: »

Wiring a cooker hood directly to the oven/cooker circuit is not acceptable without that (typical) 3A fuse. It is possible that someone has installed a socket inside a cupboard or behind some ducting - This would just about be acceptable as long as the plug can be accessed without difficulty.

Definitely nothing inside any cupboards.

By ducting - I guess you mean the cooker hood? Obviously not something the average householder (in this case a short little woman totally lacking in DIY skills of any description) would be able to access if it was inside the cooker hood for some reason. The top half of the cooker hood got taken back off by the decorator when he decorated the kitchen after it had been fitted (imagine any switch would be there?) and I saw nothing on the wall then.

Don't know if the kitchen electrician's reasoning would be that my new consumer unit is just a few steps from the kitchen and I can easily flip switches on that - even at my height.

FreeBear

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

when he explained to me that wiring "should" go down the walls to the powerpoints and he "should" be able to just pull the old wires up from above and then slot new wires down.

Wiring should run vertically, either up or down from a wall fitting. It is also permissible to run cables horizontally. They can also run vertically within 150mm of a corner of a wall without any sockets above/below - Google for "wiring safe zones" for more information.

As long as the original cables have been run through conduit or suitable capping without being clipped to the wall, new cables "should" pull through without too much difficulty.

moneyistooshorttomention

Will get my googling fingers going again then. Ta.

(Temporarily uncrossed from the "Please please let those old wires go where they are supposed to" pleas I'm silently sending up..:cool:).

Ectophile

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

1. I dont know what you mean by your question in this point?

2. The inch or so stretch of one of those old wires on a couple of these sockets had this current electrician asking me if I'd spilt any oil on them is the best way I can phrase it. Not sure if that would be what you call "leaking green goo"? Sorta slightly shiny-ish and yes it does look like I've got out my pastry brush and brushed that inch or so of the wire with a bit of oil (no I wouldnt be so daft!)

1. Basically, what FreeBear says. The fan shouldn't be wired straight into a cooker or power circuit. There should be a Fused Connection Unit (FCU) to fuse it down to 3A. If it was a Switched Fused Connection Unit (SFCU) then that would be the isolator. Alternatively, a plug and socket is fine.

2. I've only ever heard of "green goo", never seen it myself. It happens if the manufacturer adds too much plasticiser to the PVC mix (it makes the plastic more flexible). Over time it leaches out, and reacts with the copper to produce a green oily liquid. The liquid seeps out of the ends of the cables.. See https://www.voltimum.co.uk/articles/green-goo-0

It's apparently moderately toxic. So wash your hands if you touch the stuff.

Davesnave

Cooker hoods are often wired to a connection/socket inside one of the adjoining cupboards.

Of course, by the time the cupboard is stuffed with things, it is usually quite inaccessible. I need a step ladder to reach mine.

Slinky

We've just had a lot of work done on our new (1965 build) house which had original wiring in. There were twin wires with no earth in some places, these have been stripped out and updated. The electrician was very thorough, where the original wiring tested OK, he was happy to leave it, where it didn't he replaced it. He knew this was a job we wanted sorting properly as we plan to live there until we go out in a box. New consumer unit has gone in, certificate issued with recommended retest date 10 years time.

What I'm trying to say is that just because some of the original wiring has been left in place doesn't mean that those bits have been bodged necessarily.

Did your original electrician issue an official certificate? We had a handwritten copy with all the things he'd changed on it, followed by a computer issued certificate from the governing body through the post.

moneyistooshorttomention

Davesnave wrote: »

Cooker hoods are often wired to a connection/socket inside one of the adjoining cupboards.

Of course, by the time the cupboard is stuffed with things, it is usually quite inaccessible. I need a step ladder to reach mine.

I've been doing lots of general googling over the weekend and realised that some bodger electricians do that. My new electrician asked me if that was a possibility - and I told him the cupboards are exactly as they should be (ie nothing in them except the stuff I put in them myself). That location would somewhat "defeat the object" - which is to have a readily noticeable/available switch one can press fast in an emergency. I've realised this switch is non-existent:eek:. I can see such switches for my oven and hob sitting there on the wall just put in by the firm that fitted my new kitchen. The cookerhood switch should be right there beside them:(:(:(. My expensive new kitchen was duly finished earlier this year - and has duly got those switches surrounded by my expensive new Silestone upstands (because the kitchen was finished I thought and because the electrics in the house otherwise were finished I thought).:mad::mad:

Basically - it looks as if there is literally nothing I can do to add this missing switch now and it will have to stay missing:(:mad:

When that realisation dawned - as well as the "could have been electrocuted by the first electrician (yep...he was in the NIC/EIC......:cool:)" I just sat down and cried.

Mr New Electrician is coming back to finish his inspection tomorrow and I'm just going to have to get him to put the house as a whole right and accept I am/will remain missing that cookerhood switch. He, meanwhile, has got a headache I expect - knowing that its impossible to "chisel out" my walls - as the whole house was replastered and redecorated throughout after the "rewiring" (ho! ho!) was finished and work-arounds are going to have to be found to put any new wiring necessary in behind sockets/switches. Half the house has been redecorated again in fact since I initially had it redecorated - and I'm not going to be doing any redecorating again for, I estimate, 10 years.