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NTO issued from Croydon Council with no PCN. 1st Appeal rejected

Hi all

Completely out of the blue I received a NTO from Croydon council dated 24/10/2017

NTO attached here.. ... 2nkpe2s.jpg

As you would imagine, I was shocked as I was never issued a PCN! After looking at the date, time, location and limited photos, I relised that this was issued outside my place of work. I then recalled one occasion when I did indeed leave my car parked on the road while I went inside to get the key for the car park.

When I returned with the key I saw a CEO standing next to my vehicle and from across the road, I gestured that I was opening the gate to park my car. The CEO didn't say anything and just walked away. At the time I just assumed that he had relised that I was indeed about to park the vehicle so saw it as a lost cause and gave up.

On inspection of the NTO you will see that there is NO PCN attached to the vehicle and the TWO photographs published confirm this.
I immediately went online to see what was recorded there and found two additional photos showing the exact same thing only closer up (more magnified).

There are now asking me for £130! because I missed the discount period that I was not even aware of :mad::mad:

Extremely p**sed off I went on this forum to seek advise and subsequently sent the following appeal online:

PCN notice: CR*********


Dear Sir/Madam

I’m in receipt of the above Notice to Owner, yet a Penalty Charge Notice was not issued to the vehicle for which I am the Registered Keeper, therefore the Notice to Owner is the first notification I have received of the alleged offence.

A Notice to Owner may only be served if a PCN has been served in accordance with regulation 9A (regulation 19(1)(a) refers) and therefore in these circumstances the authority have committed a procedural impropriety and the PCN must be cancelled.
I would like to make representations on the grounds that there has been a procedural impropriety on the part of the enforcement authority as a PCN not served and the photographs supplied do not show a PCN affixed to my vehicle.

As a result, I require this PCN be cancelled.

Should you disagree and decide to reject the representation, I required you to provide supporting evidence for the rejection showing said PCN having been served by Civil Enforcement Officer 392, either by way of photographs showing PCN affixed to the vehicle or evidence that the PCN was handed to the driver.

I will also require:
• A copy of the Civil Enforcement Officer 392’s pocket book notes.
• The full PCN ticket history report.

Your Sincereley


They have now sent a Notice of rejection of representations (see here)...
On the second page they claim that 'the CEO made contemporaneous notes the PCN has HANDED to the driver and therefore correctly served.

the officers contemporary notes state 'driver was rude and agressive, didn't let me take picture'

This is an absolute lie, I gestured to him from the OPPOSITE SIDE of the road and we didn't even speak or come near to each other!

A copy of the CEO's contemporary notes can be seen here... 2cf5l4h.jpg

I feel aggrieved and would really appreciate some advice as to how to approach this next as I do not want to miss anything out.

I actually thought it would be over with after my first appeal but now the CEO has fabricated a story.

My main points are:

I was never given a PCN
I still haven't seen a copy of the original PCN
Discrepancies between contemporanous notes and contemporary notes - Should this be so?:

Contemporaneous notes say: PCN was handed to driver
Contemporary notes say: No driver seen, Fixed to window, driver was rude and aggressive, didn't let me take picture
The first note also appears to have a note that the ticket was placed on the windscreen (I have circled this in RED).

Why would the CEO need to take a picture if he handed me the PCN? He cant seem to make his mind up :mad:




  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 38,481 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary
    Extremely p**sed off I went on this forum to seek advise and subsequently sent the following appeal online...
    This forum? Are you sure?
    I cannot find any query of yours about this.

    Anyway, this forum tends to specialise in resolving private parking issues.

    You would be best advised to post your queries on the Pepipoo forum.
    Sign up using a gmail email address and have a look around first.
  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 41,792 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post Photogenic
    You need PePiPoo experts to help you handle this.

    Register there (but please note that a hotmail address won't work) and post a new thread; here's your link:

    Have a read through some of the other threads there before you post your own to get the hang of what information they need from you in your opening post - but as a minimum you will need to post redacted photos/scans of all correspondence you've received from the council (both sides, if appropriate) as they need to see all the small print.

    PePiPoo has an excellent success record in dealing with council tickets.
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 135,016 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post Photogenic First Anniversary
    but now the CEO has fabricated a story.

    The contemporaneous notes by the CEO are conflicting, I agree. One minute 'no driver seen' then 'aggressive driver stopped me taking a photo'!

    Smacks of possible dishonesty; these *Council* CEOs actually work for private companies and have been known to make up a pile of rubbish.

    I would take it to pepipoo and tell us when the Adjudicator agrees with you.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
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