Insulating pipes in loft.

indianabones

We had a digital shower fitted earlier this year and I want to reduce the chances of the pipes for it freezing in the loft in the winter.

Copper pipes go up and through the ceiling and then there is 50cm flexihose(haven't measure but look that long) to the shower mixer (black box). When I lag the pipes should I lag just the copper or the flexihose as well? Once I have the insulation on the pipes should I use tap or cable ties?

Grenage

Lag it all; cable ties or tape will be just fine; anything to hold it in place.

FreeBear

Tape will degrade over time, so I'd recommend cable ties - Just pull the tight enough to close hold the insulation in place without crushing it.

A.Penny.Saved

I am in a similar situation and I have thought about this but it sounds like your pipes might be a lot shorter than mine.

Do you remember that very bad winter we had -19C a few years back? Where boiler condensate pipes froze up and damaged boilers? I very much doubt that icy cold tap water siting in pipes in such temperatures would not freeze. Remember the temperature of the incoming water will be very low during very low outdoor temperatures.

A trace heater might be a worth considering if the copper pipes are of any appreciable length. Making it switchable so that you can switch it on only when the temperature drops very low. They do auto switch depending upon temperature but being able to switch it off completely seems a good idea so no power is going through it when it is not required. This is my plan when I am able to do it. When I looked at these they cost around the £75 mark depending upon length. Good insurance against a burst pipe ruining your ceiling and decor and all the expense incurred.

Or maybe change the copper pipes for plastic which conducts heat in a poorer way so is less likely to freeze the water..

indianabones

A.Penny.Saved wrote: »

I am in a similar situation and I have thought about this but it sounds like your pipes might be a lot shorter than mine.

A trace heater might be a worth considering if the copper pipes are of any appreciable length. Making it switchable so that you can switch it on only when the temperature drops very low. They do auto switch depending upon temperature but being able to switch it off completely seems a good idea so no power is going through it when it is not required. This is my plan when I am able to do it. When I looked at these they cost around the £75 mark depending upon length. Good insurance against a burst pipe ruining your ceiling and decor and all the expense incurred.

Or maybe change the copper pipes for plastic which conducts heat in a poorer way so is less likely to freeze the water..

I've spoken to the builder he thinks because of rising heat and the location of the that the pipes in the loft will be fine, but I'm not so sure. I'm going to insulate as best as I can and when I'm on holiday I'll close the valve and drain out the water. I don't think it get's cold enough regularly enough to warrant a measure like a trace heater. I've got about 2-2.5 metres of pipe work in the loft.

I also have the far easier but fiddly task of insulating all the pipework in our utility area which is as good as being outside. We had a hot water supply going to a small toilet outside.

stator

Remember there are two types of foam lagging, buy the thickest stuff, eg
https://www.toolstation.com/shop/p15527

Also remove any loft insulation that is below the pipes, and put the loft insulation over the top of the pipes, making a little cave of air underneath the insulation

A.Penny.Saved

indianabones wrote: »

I've spoken to the builder he thinks because of rising heat and the location of the that the pipes in the loft will be fine, but I'm not so sure. I'm going to insulate as best as I can and when I'm on holiday I'll close the valve and drain out the water. I don't think it get's cold enough regularly enough to warrant a measure like a trace heater. I've got about 2-2.5 metres of pipe work in the loft.

I also have the far easier but fiddly task of insulating all the pipework in our utility area which is as good as being outside. We had a hot water supply going to a small toilet outside.

Internal temperature of the home and rising heat is a factor to consider. Some people like their homes unbelievably hot, I have walked into some homes and been virtually knocked over by the heat. I cannot bear such high temperatures so rising heat is much lower. My low pitched roof is also a factor with the pipes running only 12 to 18 inches from the roof surface. I am taking this into account which is why I am seriously considering a trace heater.

My pipes run for about 5 meters which is only a short distance from the roof tiles. I will be moving the location of the shower which should help a little because ATM it is a microbore pipe embedded into the outside wall. I do intend moving it to the opposite wall of the bathroom on an internal wall which also gives it a little more distance from the roof tiles.

I believe that it pays to err on the side of caution to avoid paying the price of burst pipes and all the inconvenience caused.

Best of luck on your project but I hope it never comes down to luck

Niv

stator wrote: »

Remember there are two types of foam lagging, buy the thickest stuff, eg
https://www.toolstation.com/shop/p15527

Also remove any loft insulation that is below the pipes, and put the loft insulation over the top of the pipes, making a little cave of air underneath the insulation

I like the idea but if you do this please make sure you mark where the pipes are. Next time you go up there for something else the last thing on your mind will be pipes you cannot see!

indianabones

stator wrote: »

Remember there are two types of foam lagging, buy the thickest stuff, eg
https://www.toolstation.com/shop/p15527

Also remove any loft insulation that is below the pipes, and put the loft insulation over the top of the pipes, making a little cave of air underneath the insulation

Unfortunately as the pipes are vertical and not horizontal so not an option in terms of placing the standard insulation above the pipes. However I will definitely be getting the thick insulation you've stated.