Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

Thrugelmir

antrobus wrote: »

Their current economic system is market capitalism. It has been a lot more successful than their prior dalliance with state capitalism aka socialism.

Not without potential internal issues though in the foreseeable future.

buglawton

GreatApe wrote: »

The east is just catching up from ultra poverty towards western standards largely thanks to embracing free-er markets and capatilism

China is still poor but growing well with real wages having doubled on the decade and likely to double again in the next decade but that will still leave them at half UK wages and productivity levels and 1/3rd USA levels

But maybe toward the 2040s China will be towards UK levels of wages and productivity

Hey, don't hold China back!

kabayiri

The process whereby the East grows richer *is* causing local difficulty here.

I believe it's because the transition is not smooth, and not particularly even or predictable.

China has such enormous capacity, it could absorb a large factory/plant from here without much disruption.

They are also investing heavily in public transport. (and not just figleaf projects like HS2)

In manufacturing, we believed that one way to compete was to be smaller and more nimble, able to respond quicker to future change. That doesn't sound like the EU to me.

Thrugelmir

kabayiri wrote: »

The process whereby the East grows richer *is* causing local difficulty here.

Has grown richer. Not is. How many English football clubs now have Chinese owners......... Their money is everywhere.

GreatApe

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Forget headlines. Drill down to micro level, i.e. everybody not some.

Sure there are rich and poor but there are much fewer poor than 10 years ago and much much fewer than 20 years ago.

Their economic model is lifting the 99% i am not one to complain or put at risk their development for hate/envy of the 1% who make much more than the average person.

China is not perfect a one party rule government and I assume courts and police not as independent as in the west. Those are thing that will hopefully be fixed but dont rock the boat right now when overall the nation is moving in a net positive direction very fast.

GreatApe

antrobus wrote: »

Their current economic system is market capitalism. It has been a lot more successful than their prior dalliance with state capitalism aka socialism.

Whatever you call it it is working well. I was more talking about the Chinese not yet living as free as we do in the west. One party rule and intermingled institutions that are not very independent.

But I am willing to turn a blind eye to the negatives because on net their economic model is improving lives much more than their other negatives are hurting the citizens.

Lornapink

UK manufacturing enjoys longest period of jobs growth in 40 years
Soz' Remoaners, good news! What happened to your inflation related manufacturing slow down? You insisted as import costs rose it would cripple UK business.
https://www.ft.com/content/6e60e386-ab9a-11e8-89a1-e5de165fa619

Herzlos

Lornapink wrote: »

UK manufacturing enjoys longest period of jobs growth in 40 years
Soz' Remoaners, good news! What happened to your inflation related manufacturing slow down? You insisted as import costs rose it would cripple UK business.
https://www.ft.com/content/6e60e386-ab9a-11e8-89a1-e5de165fa619

It's paywalled, so can you summarise for us since you've read it? We're there any caveats?

It does sound like good news but I feel there's a 'but...' involved.

Zero_Gravitas

Herzlos wrote: »

It's paywalled, so can you summarise for us since you've read it? We're there any caveats?

It does sound like good news but I feel there's a 'but...' involved.

I think the text is here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/comments/9fh84d/uk_manufacturing_enjoys_longest_period_of_jobs/

And of course there are caveats. Mainly that what employers are doing currently is hiring cheap labour they can dump quickly rather than make investments in plant and equipment. Which of course also contributes to the U.K. productivity crisis.

Brexit. The gift that keeps on giving...

kabayiri

Zero_Gravitas wrote: »

...
And of course there are caveats. Mainly that what employers are doing currently is hiring cheap labour they can dump quickly rather than make investments in plant and equipment. Which of course also contributes to the U.K. productivity crisis.
...

I've been directly involved in a company decision which weighed up automation vs cheap labour. It just so happened that this labour was in the Far East, but the principle is the same.

Automation requires up front capital and long term thinking. Our market economy has preferred shorter term return for quite a while now, long before Brexit. I think there is a different mentality in Germany about this, I used to discuss it with colleagues over there.

Maybe Brexit exascerbates matters, but it isn't the direct cause.