Unsure of my minibus speed limits

unholyangel

Paradigm wrote: »

You mean this.... "A passenger vehicle, motor caravan or dual-purpose vehicle not drawing a trailer being a vehicle with an unladen weight exceeding 3·05 tonnes or adapted to carry more than 8 passengers:"???


If so, read what it says.... not what you think it says.

Fair point, I did misread the latter part initially.

But which part of that do you think OP's vehicle comes under? Bear in mind they're all legally defined.

Paradigm

unholyangel wrote: »

Fair point, I did misread the latter part initially.

But which part of that do you think OP's vehicle comes under? Bear in mind they're all legally defined.

Does this help? The lower speed limits apply to


A passenger vehicle, motor caravan or dual-purpose vehicle being a vehicle with an unladen weight exceeding 3·05 tonnes or adapted to carry more than 8 passengers:


I've removed 4 words that, due to lack of punctuation, confuse the issue.


The Ops car is a passenger carrying vehicle, it can't be anything else.

Marktheshark

N1 is vans that have to stick to 60 on dual carriageways.

unholyangel

Paradigm wrote: »

Does this help? The lower speed limits apply to


A passenger vehicle, motor caravan or dual-purpose vehicle being a vehicle with an unladen weight exceeding 3·05 tonnes or adapted to carry more than 8 passengers:


I've removed 4 words that, due to lack of punctuation, confuse the issue.


The Ops car is a passenger carrying vehicle, it can't be anything else.

A passenger vehicle is a vehicle that has been constructed solely for the carriage of passengers.

Given OP's is a MPV, I'm not sure why you'd think it has the sole purpose of carrying passengers.

sevenhills

Cripes wrote: »

I think I'll ask my local force and see what they say and report back - there does appear to be a few grey areas despite all the regulations.

You will need to speak to a traffic officer, it seems like a very complex answer.
I personally believe that your vehicle will be the same as a car, the same as a 7 seater Zafira,
I drive a 16 seater, for the purposes of private hire, many drive a 8 seater minibus on a ordinary license.

Rover_Driver

The OP's MPV could be consdered to be a Dual Purpose vehicle - constructed or adapted for the carriage of both passengers and goods with unladen weight not exceeding 2040kg - s3, The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1968.

As the unladen weight does not exceed 3.05 tonnes, it would be subject to the same speed limits as a car.

unholyangel

Rover_Driver wrote: »

The OP's MPV could be consdered to be a Dual Purpose vehicle - constructed or adapted for the carriage of both passengers and goods with unladen weight not exceeding 2040kg - s3, The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1968.

As the unladen weight does not exceed 3.05 tonnes, it would be subject to the same speed limits as a car.

Think you've possibly got the digits wrong way round on the year. The RTA says dual-purpose vehicle is given the same meaning as given in the Motor Vehicle (Construction and Use) Regulations 1978 which hasn't been digitised but the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 tells us its defined as:

a vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage both of passengers and of goods or burden of any description, being a vehicle of which the unladen weight does not exceed 2040 kg, and which either—

(i)is so constructed or adapted that the driving power of the engine is, or by the appropriate use of the controls of the vehicle can be, transmitted to all the wheels of the vehicle; or

(ii)satisfies the following conditions as to construction, namely—

(a)the vehicle must be permanently fitted with a rigid roof, with or without a sliding panel;
(b)the area of the vehicle to the rear of the driver's seat must—
(i)be permanently fitted with at least one row of transverse seats (fixed or folding) for two or more passengers and those seats must be properly sprung or cushioned and provided with upholstered back-rests, attached either to the seats or to a side or the floor of the vehicle; and
(ii)be lit on each side and at the rear by a window or windows of glass or other transparent material having an area or aggregate area of not less than 1850 square centimetres on each side and not less than 770 square centimetres at the rear; and
(c)the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the row of transverse seats satisfying the requirements specified in head (i) of sub-paragraph (b) (or, if there is more than one such row of seats, the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the rearmost such row) must, when the seats are ready for use, be not less than one-third of the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the rearmost part of the floor of the vehicle.

So it would either need to be a 4wd or satisfy all of the other requirements to be considered a dual-purpose vehicle.

Tbh I think the whole thing is a bit of a mess. There should never be this much complexity in trying to work out what speed limit applies to a vehicle.

sevenhills

unholyangel wrote: »

So it would either need to be a 4wd or satisfy all of the other requirements to be considered a dual-purpose vehicle.

Tbh I think the whole thing is a bit of a mess. There should never be this much complexity in trying to work out what speed limit applies to a vehicle.

I think the point is that it was a dual purpose vehicle, but it has been adapted to be a minibus and registered as a passenger carrying minibus, similar to a car.
I drive a 16 seat minibus, it is taxed and insured to carry passengers, it is rather large, but if I were to carry goods I would be breaking the law.

Car_54

sevenhills wrote: »

I think the point is that it was a dual purpose vehicle, but it has been adapted to be a minibus and registered as a passenger carrying minibus, similar to a car.
I drive a 16 seat minibus, it is taxed and insured to carry passengers, it is rather large, but if I were to carry goods I would be breaking the law.

But it's registered as an MPV, not as a minibus. See post #1.

unholyangel

sevenhills wrote: »

I think the point is that it was a dual purpose vehicle, but it has been adapted to be a minibus and registered as a passenger carrying minibus, similar to a car.
I drive a 16 seat minibus, it is taxed and insured to carry passengers, it is rather large, but if I were to carry goods I would be breaking the law.

Its not a minibus. A minibus is a motor vehicle designed to carry 9-16 passengers (excluding the driver).

iirc the trafic is caught out as the chassis is basically a van chassis. This is why car-derived vans that don't exceed 2t laden are subject to the same speed limits as cars, because its a car chassis.

But on reading the legislation, it appears that cars arent actually given their own speed limits, rather it sets out conditions and if any of those conditions aren't met, that vehicle can have its speed restricted.

(6)The [F42relevant authority ] shall not have power under this section to impose a speed limit, as respects driving on roads which are not restricted roads for the purposes of section 81 of this Act, on a vehicle which—
(a)is constructed solely for the carriage of passengers and their effects;
(b)is not adapted to carry more than 8 passengers exclusive of the driver;
(c)is neither a heavy motor car nor an invalid carriage;
(d)is not drawing a trailer; and
(e)is fitted with pneumatic tyres on all its wheels.

In all other cases, vehicles could potentially (not always though) have their speed limited.

suv's are not constructed solely for the carriage of passengers but they are typically a dual-purpose vehicle which has 4wd capabilities (so doesn't need to satisfy all of the other requirements about windows & proportionate space) and weighs no more than 3t unladen. So thats why they're not subject to the speed restrictions. Its not that they're classed as a car.

As I said, far more complex than it should be