My DLA to PIP saga (won)

White_musk

I received an 'invitation' to apply for PIP in November '16 after around 20 years on high rate care and mobility DLA. Form filled in and sent off in time and then a home F2F. The nurse who did my assessment was pleasant but very distant and I just felt things were going to end badly - they did. I was awarded 6 points for daily care and 4 points for mobility despite using two sticks to walk and unable to cook, wash/shower/toilet.

I sent in a MR which came back exactly the same, so I decided to appeal and go to tribunal. My appeal was heard this week. I had a Judge, Doctor, care specialist and a DWP representative. The clerk at the desk told me (quietly) I had the best group on the panel I could hope for and that turned out to be so.

It's stressful but not a really awful experience, a lot less so than I had imagined. I was asked a myriad of questions about my daily life, given plenty of time to answer and if clarification was needed then they were asked in a way where it was easy to see what they were getting at so therefore easy to answer. The DWP rep asked a couple of questions, but in the main kept his head down which was rather odd.

My appeal lasted around an hour and a half although it didn't seem that long when I was in the room. I then waited around 15 minutes for the judgement, care 13 points mobility 16 so enhanced rate for both. It was also awarded for three years.

During my PIP saga I had my ESA stopped which meant I was living with not a penny income, however I was allowed to speak to the DM and he reinstated that. Shortly after that I was sent for a Work Focused Interview as I'm in the WRAG. From now on, no more JC visits, all by phone. I was then told I needed a new medical. I had that and was again placed in the WRAG group. I did a MR and lost but after all I've been through this year don't have the energy to go to tribunal again.

My advice: Don't give up, it's what they want you to do. If I can go from 6/4 no award to 13/16 enhanced for both it shows the system is very, very badly broken.

Good luck.

Muttleythefrog

Sorry to hear of your troubles.... sadly far from rare. Interesting DWP sent a rep... sounds like they didn't input much... but I've always wondered just what they typically bring to the party when they are sent to these tribunals. Anyway... agree with your points and good luck for future.

White_musk

Muttleythefrog wrote: »

Sorry to hear of your troubles.... sadly far from rare. Interesting DWP sent a rep... sounds like they didn't input much... but I've always wondered just what they typically bring to the party when they are sent to these tribunals. Anyway... agree with your points and good luck for future.

Thank you.

Yes, it's been quite the year but right prevailed in the end. I find it astonishing that disabled and ill people can be treated this way in this (rich) country. My parents and grandparents were blessed with good health and worked past retirement. I worked until I was too ill to do so. I've never asked nor wanted something I shouldn't have just what I was entitled to.

You're right about my case not being unusual, disability charities and rights groups and up in arms about the way this is being handled. Unfortunately the Government seems to have put their fingers in their ears and are singing la la la. A total and absolute disgrace.

I was surprised to see a rep from the DWP but from the moment he saw me he put his head down - guilt? Who knows but he didn't have much to say for himself. He was also young enough to be my son which made me chuckle a bit as I realised he probably doesn't have a clue about disability.

Now I wonder how long I will have to wait for my back money as the DWP has 28 days to decide if they are going to appeal. I can't see any grounds as they can only appeal on points of law, but we shall see.

nannytone_2

when it comes to ESA, i don't give them the chance to put me in the WRAG.
i complete the ESA50 and at every opportunity, i tell them which support group descriptor i meet and send evidence to this effect.

i get re awarded support group without the need for an assessment.

you can't leave it to chance or opinion. if you meet a support group descriptor ... tell them which one you meet and why you meet it

White_musk

nannytone wrote: »

when it comes to ESA, i don't give them the chance to put me in the WRAG.
i complete the ESA50 and at every opportunity, i tell them which support group descriptor i meet and send evidence to this effect.

i get re awarded support group without the need for an assessment.

you can't leave it to chance or opinion. if you meet a support group descriptor ... tell them which one you meet and why you meet it

Thank you.

I did check out the descriptors and while I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head do know that I got way, way above the points needed and I was very conservative with my answers as it's too easy for me to run away with myself so was very careful. I will have a look at my letter, I may still have time to appeal, now PIP is over I have one worry less.

White_musk

White_musk wrote: »

Thank you.

I did check out the descriptors and while I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head do know that I got way, way above the points needed and I was very conservative with my answers as it's too easy for me to run away with myself so was very careful. I will have a look at my letter, I may still have time to appeal, now PIP is over I have one worry less.

I've checked the dates and have to appeal one month from 03 August so am in time. I shall get a letter written for the tribunal this weekend.

Thank you Nanny, you've made me sit up and realise I shouldn't allow them to disallow what I am entitled too. Fire in the belly again.

50Twuncle

I hadn't realised that the appeal involved a "court" situation - with Judge etc ?
I had just assumed that it was a higher level "paperwork exercise"
This must be extremely hard for many people to cope with ?

White_musk

50Twuncle wrote: »

I hadn't realised that the appeal involved a "court" situation - with Judge etc ?
I had just assumed that it was a higher level "paperwork exercise"
This must be extremely hard for many people to cope with ?

It's as user friendly as it could be. The 'bench' sits at one side of the table, I and the DWP rep sat the other. The Judge asks his questions, then the Doctor then the Care rep. The Judge takes notes all the while you're being questioned. Then the DWP rep asks their questions. The Judge then wraps it all up with any further questions and an explanation they are going to discuss your case and you'll get you're result soon.

I went back into the waiting room and didn't wait long at all. I would say that it it's more like just a chat and nothing at all like a court. No swearing of oaths, no ushers, no wigs and cloaks, just five people in a room having a chat. The 'bench' are not intimidating, I didn't feel under any pressure, allowed to answer in my own time. It is stressful, but it's nowhere as bad as what I had imagined it would be.

nannytone_2

White_musk wrote: »

Thank you.

I did check out the descriptors and while I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head do know that I got way, way above the points needed and I was very conservative with my answers as it's too easy for me to run away with myself so was very careful. I will have a look at my letter, I may still have time to appeal, now PIP is over I have one worry less.

there are no points involved with meeting support group descrptors. all you have to do is meet one r more of the descriptors.
i meet 7 ii. cannot read 16 point print and cabbot read braille.
i don't need to gain ny points for the WRAG at all.

you, like many other people, harp on about 'points'. if you took the time to undrstand how ESA works, would realise that points are irrelevant when it comes to the support group.

they sy ' i scored 10 million points!' but you didn't look into the support group descriptors so you gt nothing

Alice_Holt

Well done OP
And thanks for your comments on the tribunal process.

At our CAB it's far from uncommon for clients to be get an award at tribunal from 0 points at assessment.
In my experience the panels are usually very thorough and apply the descriptors fairly.
They are also skilled at listening to appellants, and getting relevant information from them.

BTW - Here are the SG descriptors for ESA:
https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/employment-and-support-allowance/esa-glossary/1353-support-group-descriptors, and
http://www.cpag.org.uk/content/making-exception (Reg 35)

Torry_Quine

My tribunal experience was very similar to th OPs. I had no PIP award at all with 6 care points and 4 mobility points and the tribunal awarded me enhanced care and standard mobility for four years.

I too had a DWP representative who said little. The panel were very good and the doctor in particular picked up that my letter asking for a tribunal was unfinished, no doubt due to my health issues. He then asked questions about what else I would have put in the lettter and it certainly appeared to affect the result in my favour.

I had to wait outside for a good time for the result and had convinced myself I'd lost