Can I still recover from the situation POPLA appeal rejected

cigaash

Thank you. The 30 days period certainly helps so I have got a bit more time for research. I have edited the thread and corrected the name. I will post a new draft to this thread soon

Redx

still too many hints as to who did what in post #1

anything related to the day in question is about THE DRIVER

anything that has happened since happened to THE KEEPER

cigaash

Thank you. Yes there was previous post regarding how to deal with failed appeal. I did not mean to start a new thread randomly. I waited for the LBC and thought it was easier for people to help without spending too much trawling through my old post as there are lot of people needing assistance here. Maybe I got it wrong.

Redx

the info in the previous thread may be relevant and missing from any new thread

you make it hard for people using phones and tablets to view this forum to help you by having too many threads open

one topic - one case - one thread , that is the golden rule

you can pm soolin or crabman and ask them to merge the two threads into one , also asking them to change your merged thread title if you so desire

cigaash

Thank. Redex, Since I have already gone through the appeal process and admitted everything. I guess it is too late to use the driver, keeper argument in defence?

Redx

yes , if that is the case then you dont need to edit the posts as the driver has been "outed" - sorry

a shame because if not then it added more protection to the keeper under POFA2012

cigaash

I have looked at the update to date LBC rebuttal. Does the draft below make sense? I'm not completely sure if I can use point 2, 3, 4 and 5.


Regarding 2&3, I disclosed who was the driver during appeal process
Regarding point 4, they did send a Schedule of information with summary of terms (please refer to the picture I uploaded onto google drive).
Regarding point 5, in the draft particulars there is one time item stating "the defendant breached the terms and conditions of the site and, as such is liable to pay the claimant the amounts as set out in the attached schedule of information". So presumable this is breach of contract? Should I add a "without prejudice" settlement offer at the end of the letter? Appreciate your help


Dear Sirs,
I am in receipt of your Letter Before Action of 9th November 2017.
Your letter contains insufficient detail of the claim and fails to provide copies of evidence your client places reliance upon.
Your client must know that on 01 October 2017 a new protocol is applicable to debt claims. Since proceedings have not yet been issued, the new protocol clearly applies and must be complied with.

Your letter lacks specificity and breaches both the requirements of the previously applicable Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct (paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c)) and the new Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (paragraphs 3.1(a)-(d), 5.1 and 5.2. Please treat this letter as a formal request for all of the documents / information that the protocol now requires your client to provide. Your client must not issue proceedings without complying with that protocol. I reserve the right to draw any failure of the Claimant to comply with the protocol to the attention of the court and to ask the court to stay the claim and order your client to comply with its pre-action obligations, and when costs come to be considered.

As solicitors you must surely be familiar with the requirements of both the Practice Direction applicable pre-1 October and the Protocol which applies thereafter (and your client, as a serial litigator of small claims, should likewise be aware of them). As you (and your client) must know, the Practice Direction and Protocol binds all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time. It is astounding that a firm of Solicitors are sending a consumer a vague and unevidenced 'Letter before Claim' in complete ignorance of the pre-existing Practice Direction and the new.

Nobody, including your client, is immune from the requirements and obligations of the Practice Direction and now the Protocol.
I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:
1. an explanation of the cause of action
2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, a copy of any alleged contract with the driver. Or is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
6. a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim, as required by the IPC code of practice section B, clause 1.1
7. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
9. Details of the additions to the original charge, what that represents and how it has been calculated.

If your client does not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) – Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13 ,15(b) and (c) and 16 of the Practice Direction, as referred to in paragraph 7.2 of the Protocol.
Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.

soolin

Threads merged as requested.

cigaash

can someone help to have a look at the LBC rebuttal letter please?

Coupon-mad

Should I add a "without prejudice" settlement offer at the end of the letter?

Nope, not anywhere. It's not relevant, and would then mean you can't show your letter in court!

Don't forget what Redx said, you can bring this into the reply too, not 'asking', but pointing out the regime is NOT ALLOWED:

and ask why these health centres and trusts continue to break the NHS guidelines too (tell them about UHW in cardiff Indigo fiasco too , see parking prankster blogs)

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles