Parking finewaitrose in taxi/collection bay

Guys_Dad

I admire the dedication and altruism of the many contributors on here who are willing to help all motorists fight PPCS, no matter how selfish and inconsiderate the motorist in question has been.

I also admire the regulars who are selective about those they help.

julsjasper

thanks for the genuine people on here cheers!

julsjasper

Hi followed advice and emailed BPA asking to cancel the ticket but their reply is:
[FONT=&quot]Thank you for your email regarding Britannia Parking who are members of the BPA’s Approved Operator Scheme (AOS) and follow the AOS Code of Practice (CoP). [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In order to obtain the address and Registered Keeper details from the DVLA, a parking operator has to have reasonable cause to do so. If the Parking charge notice was left affixed to the motorist’s vehicle, and the motorist wrote to appeal it providing the driver’s serviceable address, then in that scenario, there would be no reasonable cause to contact the DVLA for address details, and to issue a Notice to Keeper. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Because Britannia Parking are an AOS Member, they are aware that the CoP requires them to issue a response to an appeal within a set time frame, provided it was received by them within the required time frames, and provided the appeal gives them a serviceable address to respond to. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You have advised you wrote to the operator, was recorded delivery used? This is the only way to ascertain whether correspondence has been received as a signature is required. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Please also be advised that when entering private property, the terms and conditions of the use of the site, as determined by the private landowner, will be advertised on the signage. The landowner can contract a private parking operator to manage their property. If a motorist breaches the advertised terms and conditions of the site, then a parking charge is issued. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As a membership association and not regulatory body, we will not become involved in a dispute between a motorist and a private parking operator, as we do not have the authority to do so. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]All appeals are a matter for the landowner/parking operators’ procedure with the option to escalate the matter via POPLA, the independent parking on private land appeals service if eligible and or the courts. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The timescale of 57 days you have referred to relate to a piece of legislation referred to as POFA 2012, not all PCN’s are issued utilising this legislation. If the legislation is being utilised it will be referred to on the PCN you received on 3rd June. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I would firstly suggest contacting the parking operator to ascertain whether they received your appeal. Additionally, if you have evidence that you sent your appeal of 28th June via recorded delivery, then please supply this by return mail and we will endeavour to advise you further.

What am I meant to do now?

[/FONT]

Umkomaas

In order to obtain the address and Registered Keeper details from the DVLA, a parking operator has to have reasonable cause to do so. If the Parking charge notice was left affixed to the motorist’s vehicle, and the motorist wrote to appeal it providing the driver’s serviceable address, then in that scenario, there would be no reasonable cause to contact the DVLA for address details, and to issue a Notice to Keeper.

I'd respond to say that you as 'The Keeper' responded and did not provide 'the driver's' name and address for service (as is your legal right), therefore unless the PPC knows who the driver is, they can only pursue the keeper. In order to pursue the keeper, they must acquire the keeper's details from the DVLA and issue a fully compliant Notice to Keeper. As they have failed on both accounts, and it is now beyond the 56 days when a NtK can be issued, they have no case to pursue.

Copy this in to David Dunford of the DVLA and ask him to confirm to the BPA that your assertion is the correct one.

david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk

julsjasper

Ill try that much appreciated

julsjasper

[FONT=&quot]I followed the advice and so far have another email stating:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The timescale of 57 days you have referred to relate to a piece of legislation referred to as Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA 2012), but not all PCN’s are issued utilising this legislation in England and Wales. If the legislation is being utilised it will be referred to on the PCN you received on 3rd June. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You do not have to name the driver of the vehicle, but if the parking operator does not have the name and serviceable address of the driver, they will still pursue the Registered Keeper for the unpaid ticket under the reasonable assumption that the Registered Keeper knows or was the driver at the time of the alleged contravention. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This process has been followed by parking operators prior to the inception of POFA 2012 in England and Wales, and is still followed by those who do not utilise the legislation. It is also standard process for parking operators who issue PCN’s in Scotland or Northern Ireland where POFA 2012 is not recognised.

Im still waiting hear back from the other guy you suggested I copy ermail into....

Im unclear if Im winning or not? Nothing at all frrom Brittania, of course
[/FONT]

Fruitcake

julsjasper wrote: »

[FONT=&quot]I followed the advice and so far have another email stating:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The timescale of 57 days you have referred to relate to a piece of legislation referred to as Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA 2012), but not all PCN’s are issued utilising this legislation in England and Wales. If the legislation is being utilised it will be referred to on the PCN you received on 3rd June. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You do not have to name the driver of the vehicle, but if the parking operator does not have the name and serviceable address of the driver, they will still pursue the Registered Keeper for the unpaid ticket under the reasonable assumption that the Registered Keeper knows or was the driver at the time of the alleged contravention. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This process has been followed by parking operators prior to the inception of POFA 2012 in England and Wales, and is still followed by those who do not utilise the legislation. It is also standard process for parking operators who issue PCN’s in Scotland or Northern Ireland where POFA 2012 is not recognised.

Im still waiting hear back from the other guy you suggested I copy ermail into....

Im unclear if Im winning or not? Nothing at all frrom Brittania, of course
[/FONT]

Who sent you that load of twaddle?

There can be no assumption, reasonable or otherwise, that the driver is the keeper and whoever sent you that needs taking to task over it.

From page 13 of the 2015 PoPLA annual report by the very well respected Lead Adjudicator and barrister, Henry Greenslade.

https://popla.co.uk/docs/default-source/default-document-library/popla_annualreport_2015.pdf?sfvrsn=2

However keeper information is obtained, there is no ‘reasonable presumption’ in law that the registered keeper of a vehicle is the driver. Operators should never suggest anything of the sort.

Umkomaas

Was that from the BPA? They can't be allowed to spout bilge like that to a keeper who is inevitably more naive about the intricacies of all this than they are.

they will still pursue the Registered Keeper for the unpaid ticket under the reasonable assumption that the Registered Keeper knows or was the driver at the time of the alleged contravention.

So what if the keeper knows the driver. What legal point do they rely on for this? This makes me quite mad.

If this has come from the BPA, you must immediately refer it to David Dunford of the DVLA and ask him to explain to you why the DVLA is allowing the BPA to mislead keepers on this basis. Ask him who is supposed to be protecting the motorist from the lies, smoke and mirrors of all this. Things are getting totally out of control.

Please do this.