POPLA Appeal- REBUTTAL DRAFT - PCN from Premier Park - 7 minutes!

toblerone13

Umkomaas,

Yep, I put the "13.4 You should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the private car park after the parking contract has ended, before you take enforcement action. If the location is one where parking is normally permitted, the Grace Period at the end of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes; not the 5 minutes that they have deemed reasonable. " into my rebuttal.

toblerone13

I've had a look but can't see one in the Newbies sticky... is there a draft for a letter? Do many people write to John Gallagher?

nosferatu1001

There is of course no template
Start drafting it - youve been given points already.

beamerguy

When will John Gallagher start training his staff properly
as right now such assessors are making POPLA look plain stupid

Coupon-mad

When I typed this, two days ago:

If POPLA reject the appeal (and that would be ludicrous) then this would be practically impossible for Premier Park to win at a real hearing. Their evidence is dire, the grace period not adequate and the ticketing in this case is predatory and exactly the sort of issue that gave rise to the BPA CoP rules on Grace Periods.

it was partly because I suspected POPLA might reject the decent appeal made.

Because John Gallagher himself is the person who arbitrarily decided (obviously wrongly...come on man, it's a prescribed Government statute, as the previous POPLA Assessor team - legally trained, fair people - knew!) that the Premier Park 'within 29 days' could be interpreted BY HIM as compliant.

There was a shocking decision on pepipoo forum where his reply to a complaint actually said he knew that ambiguity had to the determined in the way that most favours a consumer, but he reckoned he had done that - by interpreting the PP NTK as compliant, and in doing so (wrongly), making the consumer lose. Yep, that was apparently interpreting the PP crap in the way that most favoured the appellant in that case...

Sometimes, and usually with Premier Park or ParkingEye cases, this POPLA *service* is diabolical.

A complaint to Mr Gallagher who seems to love ex-clamper nasties, Premier Park, is going to be fruitless. Wait and see if a court claim is tried. This is defendable.

As we've all said, including the OP, six or seven minutes all told from driving in to driving out is not a parking contract agreed, it's leaving within a perfectly reasonable observation/reading the signs then deciding NOT to accept any parking contract 'grace period'.

How else does POPLA think the BPA grace periods apply then? This is what they were written to stop (kind of, if you trust the BPA motives...). The rules were written to create a veil of legitimacy at least, and POPLA should be applying those rules properly.

toblerone13

Thank you so much to everyone. I really appreciate you all taking the time to read, reply and give your opinions and advice. So, I am going to be brave (feels like I'm going to be taken to court and ordered to pay court fees etc. - is this the case??) and wait to see what they send me.

Quentin

They have 6 years to start legal proceedings


As advised now wait and see if they try (ignore any debt collecting letters you get)


You only have to go to court if this ends up with a hearing, and won't have any fees to pay unless you lose in court

Castle

POPLA showing their inconsistency; in this assessment, 10 minutes was deemed to be a reasonable grace period!:-
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5693951

toblerone13

I know I'm probably coming across quite whiney but... how often do they take ppl to court and get a hearing? And if that happens and I did lose, how much are court fees. I know they want me to be scared and thats why they win and ppl pay but it is all a bit scary!

freester

So a few years ago I got 'caught' by Premier Park. Failed at POPLA because I drafted a bad appeal, mitigating circumstances, revealed who was driving etc etc before I found this forum.

After the rejection I found this place. Sent a strongly worded letter to them saying basically 'since the POPLA appeal I have become aware of signage requirements, BPA COP, Beavis etc etc and nothing in the car park met those requirements'.

So in your case as well as what is recommended above I'd compose a letter to PP saying:

- Despite the POPLA appeal rejection you are certain Premier Park did not follow POFA and so you as keeper can't be held liable
- You are certain your overstay was well within grace periods as recommended in BPA COP
- Signage did not meet BPA COP recommendations
- Key point of Beavis was the clear signage (because they will mention Beavis as a precedence in correspondence they send you)

Request that they not to send any more correspondence unless it is a Letter Before Claim and that you intend to vigorously defend any claim in court.

This is essentially what I did - haven't heard from them for 18 months. No debt recovery letters, nothing.