The Nice People Thread, No.16: A Universe of Niceness.

Pyxis

Thanks for the heads-up!

Can you remind us again in 5 days time?

silvercar

Viva, what information does the DNA test give you? Is it reliable?

PasturesNew

Just randomly poking around in the pensions bit of online tax etc.... not seen this bit before.... I've got 40 years of NI towards a pension ... starting 1976-77.

There are two further years they say they're checking/not sure about.

40 sounds "enough" to me, so I can stop worrying that I've not got enough.

chris_m

PasturesNew wrote: »

Just randomly poking around in the pensions bit of online tax etc.... not seen this bit before.... I've got 40 years of NI towards a pension ... starting 1976-77.
There are two further years they say they're checking/not sure about.
40 sounds "enough" to me, so I can stop worrying that I've not got enough.

Unless they change the rules again before you are due to start drawing it, you only require 35 qualifying years of NI to get the full New State Pension, IIRC, so 40 should be lovely jubbly.

GDB2222

PasturesNew wrote: »

Just randomly poking around in the pensions bit of online tax etc.... not seen this bit before.... I've got 40 years of NI towards a pension ... starting 1976-77.

There are two further years they say they're checking/not sure about.

40 sounds "enough" to me, so I can stop worrying that I've not got enough.

chris_m wrote: »

Unless they change the rules again before you are due to start drawing it, you only require 35 qualifying years of NI to get the full New State Pension, IIRC, so 40 should be lovely jubbly.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

This is the UK state pension you are talking about, and it's more complicated than that. It depends whether you were contracted out at any time, and if you had any periods without earning (much) whether you have had any credits for those periods. This being the UK state scheme it probably also takes into account the colour of your kitchen cupboards and how you arrange the cutlery drawer.

In my case, I have over 40 years' contributions, but I still need to contribute to get the full pension.

The easy way to deal with this is to request a state pension forecast. https://www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

You may be eligible for automatic credits, but the rules for that are far far beyond my pay grade. Somebody at DWP can advise you, though.

Even if you pay voluntary contributions, they tend to be good value (a small contribution gets you a lot of pension), so it's best to find out before it's too late whether you will benefit.

PasturesNew

GDB2222 wrote: »

.... it's more complicated than that.....

isn't it always.

Information written by the industry, for the industry ... that just goes WHOOSH to the rest of us!

I clicked that link, logged on and it seems to indicate I would get it.

"You can get your State Pension on ....." (9 years' time)

But then it says:

"Your forecast is not a guarantee and is based on the current law" - so does that mean I've got it .... or is that a get out ... reads as if "I've got it already" and that would only change if the law changed .... not that I'm "short" of anything.

But the next line then says:

"You need to continue to contribute National Insurance to reach your forecast" - and it then seems to indicate I'm 5 years short "Forecast if you contribute another 5 years" which then shows the same figure as at the top of the page.

But then it says "You cannot improve your forecast any further, unless you choose to put off claiming."

So if I can't improve my forecast ..... why are there two figures .....

That page is utterly ... confusing and uninformative and doesn't answer the question.

I read all the relevant pages ..... and am more confused/scared than 10 minutes ago when I thought "that's it then" - and I have no desire to contact any "professional" as I know I'd end up more confused and scared than I am right now.

michaels

GDB2222 wrote: »

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

This is the UK state pension you are talking about, and it's more complicated than that. It depends whether you were contracted out at any time, and if you had any periods without earning (much) whether you have had any credits for those periods. This being the UK state scheme it probably also takes into account the colour of your kitchen cupboards and how you arrange the cutlery drawer.

In my case, I have over 40 years' contributions, but I still need to contribute to get the full pension.

The easy way to deal with this is to request a state pension forecast. https://www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

You may be eligible for automatic credits, but the rules for that are far far beyond my pay grade. Somebody at DWP can advise you, though.

Even if you pay voluntary contributions, they tend to be good value (a small contribution gets you a lot of pension), so it's best to find out before it's too late whether you will benefit.

Or like me you can have max contributions after only working 20 years and not get any benefit from any ni I pay from now until retirement because I didn't opt out....

GDB2222

PasturesNew wrote: »

isn't it always.

Information written by the industry, for the industry ... that just goes WHOOSH to the rest of us!

I clicked that link, logged on and it seems to indicate I would get it.

"You can get your State Pension on ....." (9 years' time)

But then it says:

"Your forecast is not a guarantee and is based on the current law" - so does that mean I've got it .... or is that a get out ... reads as if "I've got it already" and that would only change if the law changed .... not that I'm "short" of anything.

But the next line then says:

"You need to continue to contribute National Insurance to reach your forecast" - and it then seems to indicate I'm 5 years short "Forecast if you contribute another 5 years" which then shows the same figure as at the top of the page.

But then it says "You cannot improve your forecast any further, unless you choose to put off claiming."

So if I can't improve my forecast ..... why are there two figures .....

That page is utterly ... confusing and uninformative and doesn't answer the question.

I read all the relevant pages ..... and am more confused/scared than 10 minutes ago when I thought "that's it then" - and I have no desire to contact any "professional" as I know I'd end up more confused and scared than I am right now.

I agree it's confusing. Does it contain a section that reads like this?

"Your Contracted Out Pension Equivalent
In the past you've been 'contracted out' of the additional State
Pension.
When you were contracted out
. you and your employers paid lower rate National Insurance
contributions, or
. some of your National Insurance contributions were paid into
another pension scheme, such as a personal or stakeholder
pension
The amount of additional State Pension you would have been paid
if you had not been contracted out is known as the Contracted Out Pension Equivalent (COPE).
Your COPE estimate is
£XX.XX a week"

The short version of how the State pension works is that you get the maximum pension of £159.55 if you have 35 years' contributions. However, the COPE amount gets knocked off that, but you can earn an extra £4.56 a week for each year's contributions starting from 6 April 2016 to counteract the COPE.

So, if your COPE is around £25, you will need contributions (paid or credited) until 5 April 2022 to counteract it and bring you up to the maximum.

Fortunately, the figures they forecast are net of the COPE deduction. You don't have to deduct it from the forecast figures.



"Your forecast is not a guarantee and is based on the current law" - that's just a standard get-out, as governments change the scheme all the time.


"reads as if "I've got it already" and that would only change if the law changed .... not that I'm "short" of anything. - I think (without seeing it) they have given you two forecasts. One is based on contributions already paid/credited and the other is based on what you'll get if you continue to contribute/get credited contributions. Both forecasts assume no change in the state pension scheme.


"You need to continue to contribute National Insurance to reach your forecast" - and it then seems to indicate I'm 5 years short "Forecast if you contribute another 5 years" which then shows the same figure as at the top of the page. - I think it's pretty clear that to get the higher figure you need to contribute another 5 years.


But then it says "You cannot improve your forecast any further, unless you choose to put off claiming."
So if I can't improve my forecast ..... why are there two figures

Is the higher figure £159.55? That's (for most people) the maximum available. So, once you have enough contributions for £159.55, you can't improve it any further, but to get to that figure you need another five years. The lower figure is what you have already, based on your contributions to date.


I hope this lengthy explanation hasn't added to the confusion/scare.



The govt. published a short 37 page booklet Your State Pension statement explained.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/611591/your-state-pension-statement-explained-dwp042.pdf

PasturesNew

GDB2222 wrote: »

When you were contracted out

Yes.

Years ago I remember a man told me to sign a form and it was contracting out. Might've been The Pru as I took out a pension. 3 months later I lost my job so couldn't keep it up - by the time I got another job and got straight again and contacted them they said about the policy not being able to be "caught up" as I'd thought I could just pay them all the missing premiums.... but it was "closed" to money.

After that, I just got on with my life .... and have never understood it, or what went on, or why etc. To be honest.

So, yes I did "contract out" as I remember being told to sign a paper - but I was only in that job another couple of months and never had a private pension beyond that following couple of months. Circa ... 1988.

None of it was an "informed choice I set out to find" - there was just this salesman saying "sign this" and I did....

As I'd clearly c0cked up this first pension and didn't really understand them - and never really had much money, I never got another private pension at all in case it all happened again (which it would've done, repeatedly) ... and I'd have been sitting here with 20+ duff pensions in a pile.

LydiaJ

You explain it very clearly, GDB, but I still can't make sense of mine.

It says I qualify for £x as of now, and will get the full amount if I work another 8 years. So far so good.

But it says I have 27 full years of contributions, so the 8 extra would only get me up to 35, with no extra to cover the COPE. Meanwhile it says I have COPE of £23.05 a week, which is not surprising because I've been contracted for very nearly all the work I've ever done.

Not that I'm complaining, or anything, but how come I can get the full amount by paying in for only 35 years despite having all that COPE????

And if I get COPE of £23.05 for spending almost my entire life contracted out, then wouldn't PN have an absolutely trivial COPE deduction for having been contracted out for a few months only???

Edit: OK, now I understand. It seems that years after 2016 count towards the 35 years target and simultaneously for overcoming the COPE, which seems a bit odd, but that's how they do it.