Local Government Continuous Service

Chloe_G

I am resigning from work and my last day will be a Friday. I've got a new job at which will start on the following Monday. The jobs are in schools and so my pension will stay will the local authority. However as one contract will end on a Friday and the other starts on a Monday will this count as continuous service?

sangie595

Your pension isn't with the local authority. Your pension is with a pension provider associated with the local authority. But independent. Lots of people have "local authority pensions" who don't work for local authorities.

Many schools now are independent employers with no empowerment association with the local authority. So nobody here can tell you whether your service is continuous. You will have to ask the employer.

hyubh

Chloe_G wrote: »

I am resigning from work and my last day will be a Friday. I've got a new job at which will start on the following Monday. The jobs are in schools and so my pension will stay will the local authority. However as one contract will end on a Friday and the other starts on a Monday will this count as continuous service?

Best check with HR, if you mean for non-pension purposes. With respect to the pension, the default for multiple employments has gone back to separate memberships with the option to aggregate (combine), and this is irrespective of whether there's a gap or not.

If your old pension is all CARE then you probably might as well aggregate; if you have final salary (i.e. pre-April 2014) service, then the main thing to think about is whether your rate of pay has gone up, down, or stayed the same. It's not that complicated really, but it is in your interests to make a conscious decision.

hyubh

sangie595 wrote: »

Your pension isn't with the local authority. Your pension is with a pension provider associated with the local authority. But independent.

Well no, the 'administering authority' for an LGPS fund will be a local authority (the day-to-day administration might be outsourced, though even then, probably not - most LGPS admin is still in house). If the schools concerned are still LEA maintained, then the employer for pension purposes will also be a local authority, possibly the same one.

Lots of people have "local authority pensions" who don't work for local authorities.

Of course - but those that do still form well over half the membership.

sangie595

hyubh wrote: »

Well no, the 'administering authority' for an LGPS fund will be a local authority (the day-to-day administration might be outsourced, though even then, probably not - most LGPS admin is still in house). If the schools concerned are still LEA maintained, then the employer for pension purposes will also be a local authority, possibly the same one.



Of course - but those that do still form well over half the membership.

Well no. Most local government pension schemes are maintained by multiple authorities and are not "owned" by any authority. And membership of a pension scheme is not an indicator of continuous service, which is what the OP asked about - do they have continuous service.

hyubh

sangie595 wrote: »

Well no. Most local government pension schemes are maintained by multiple authorities and are not "owned" by any authority.

Erm, this is incorrect, if by this you are denying the particular role of the administering authority in law. See the start of Part 2 of the current LGPS Regulations - 'an administering authority is responsible for managing and administering the Scheme'. The administering authority will appoint the actuary, formulate the investment strategy, organise the day-to-day administration, etc. Other employers will have a say, but they aren't ultimately responsible for such matters.

And membership of a pension scheme is not an indicator of continuous service, which is what the OP asked about - do they have continuous service.

The OP mentioned their pension situation in passing but got it slightly wrong. You picked up on this, but only to get it even more wrong. I then replied purely on the pension issue ('Best check with HR, if you mean for non-pension purposes').

That said, if I were to be pedantic, I could emphasise that 'continuous service' is a thing in the LGPS too, though with a different definition to when the term is applied in the context of local authority employment terms and conditions...

Chloe_G

It will be with the same provider - the schools I work for use the same pension scheme which is (or was) provided by the LA. I have 25 years continuous service so I just wondered if I should ask my current school to finish the contract on a Sunday. I will ask the Finance and HR person but she is worse than useless. Sometimes we don't get paid on time, and sometimes our pay is wrong.

sangie595

Your pension is irrelevant for continuous service. The test of continuous service is whether the school is an associated employer. If they are not, then the answer is no. If they are, then your continuous service is preserved.

sangie595

hyubh wrote: »

Erm, this is incorrect, if by this you are denying the particular role of the administering authority in law. See the start of Part 2 of the current LGPS Regulations - 'an administering authority is responsible for managing and administering the Scheme'. The administering authority will appoint the actuary, formulate the investment strategy, organise the day-to-day administration, etc. Other employers will have a say, but they aren't ultimately responsible for such matters.



The OP mentioned their pension situation in passing but got it slightly wrong. You picked up on this, but only to get it even more wrong. I then replied purely on the pension issue ('Best check with HR, if you mean for non-pension purposes').

That said, if I were to be pedantic, I could emphasise that 'continuous service' is a thing in the LGPS too, though with a different definition to when the term is applied in the context of local authority employment terms and conditions...

Well you think what you want , and I'll think what I know about the pension schemes our employers actually run. The pension is irrelevant. Continuous service - the thing that protects your entitlement to be treated fairly in law, and to redundancy payments, friends not on the pension you belong to, but to whether or not the employers are associated in law.

hyubh

sangie595 wrote: »

Well you think what you want , and I'll think what I know about the pension schemes our employers actually run.

Hmm, looking at your posting history, I see you've got 'form' for getting all arsey when corrected by someone who actually knows the LGPS! Hopefully you ask a colleague when a member has a pension issue

The pension is irrelevant.

It's not irrelevant because it involves it's own issue, viz.: should the OP aggregate her pensionable memberships after starting with the other school?

Continuous service - the thing that protects your entitlement to be treated fairly in law, and to redundancy payments, friends not on the pension you belong to, but to whether or not the employers are associated in law.

That's one application of the term, yes - the LGPS has another. I think we're agreed it's best not to conflate them...?

hyubh

Chloe_G wrote: »

It will be with the same provider - the schools I work for use the same pension scheme which is (or was) provided by the LA.

If things are done properly (which going by what you say, might not be!), this will still be discontinuous service from a pensions point of view, i.e. you will formally leave (become 'deferred') and rejoin afresh. As I think has now been emphasised to a very high degree (!), that's nothing to do with continuous service in the sense of leave entitlements etc. though.

I have 25 years continuous service so I just wondered if I should ask my current school to finish the contract on a Sunday.

That would be the normal situation - I'd get confirmation that this is indeed your formal date of leaving. That said, I *think* a gap of less than a week still counts as continuous for 'Green Book' purposes. If only there was a union official who regularly posts on this board to pop up and confirm